Tiger tanks being built out of Factorys

What about if the Ostheer could build Tiger tanks out of a factory, Because the Russians can build IS2 out of their factory. :P

Place a build limit on them, and make them less effective, but it would be cool to control two tigers at once.

I like the idea, but they should be decidedly weaker compared to the call in Tiger for Blitzkrieg, and maybe since these are early mass production tigers they could be easier to knock the engine out.

naw if you want to make them weaker then the Blitz Tiger then don't unit cap it... I say make them as strong as a Blitz Tiger but unit cap them at 2 or 3...

Tigers out of factory are great, as long as theyll be the only non doctrinal heavy armor. 700MP/150fuel is the right price for a tiger.
No Panthers for Ostheer.

you can make buldable tigers using corsix mod studio is very easy.

Why? I personally don't think it's required...and no Panther tanks for Ostheer? Sorry, can't agree with that. I say keep Tigers a doctrinal weapon. Perhaps in one doctrine there is an ability that allows Tigers to be built out of a factory (w/ limits of course). I'm doing just fine however with Panthers being the best tank being built out of factories however. If you gather up enough resources, you can have as much as 3 Panthers in the field and w/ them in a group along with some support they can be devastating.

I remember of a time (2006 - patch 1.0) when you could play whith  2 Tigers. It was a glorious time, so why not bring it again the possibility?
Maybe limited by two Tigers.

My opinion but open for sugestions.

that idea of buildable Tiger and no Panther is good i think but from some doctrine you can call in armor group - 3 panthers for 1500 manspower... :) that should be i think its better to build tiger then panther which should be called in...

GamblerSK wrote:
that idea of buildable Tiger and no Panther is good i think but from some doctrine you can call in armor group - 3 panthers for 1500 manspower... :) that should be i think its better to build tiger then panther which should be called in...

I agree with this, buildable tigers with Panther Doctrine call in? It could work

with or without tiger there has to be a tank that goes with the role of the panther

what if once you have the building for doing tanks you can call in a tiger, but it will cost man power and exp points. doing this you can have a tiger, but you need more time to have doctrine things, you cant spam. the cost has to be something that makes the tiger a shock unit, maybe this cant be done, but its a idea:P

ScreamingStukas wrote:
Why? I personally don't think it's required...and no Panther tanks for Ostheer? Sorry, can't agree with that. I say keep Tigers a doctrinal weapon.

If every of 3 german armies had panthers that would suck. Whats the point of having different armies but same units?
Tiger I is a rarely used wermacht unit so it would be great to have it. One on the map limit.
Ostheer tigers would be weaker than veted wermacht tigers.

If allies would start to spam IS-2 or Fireflies 1 tiger wont stop them. Ostheer would then have to use a JagdpanzerIV - the heaviest non doctrine tank destroyer compareble to SU-100.

Even if the Tiger I would cost 800MP/200fuel it would be nice to have a "finish them off" unit.

If its gonna be that much I would want it to be as powerful as a Wehr tiger that is extremely expensive, the Wehr tiger is only 900 and with a PE ally you can get as many as you want (with in reason obviously)

I would rather see it as a Non-doctrinal call-inn. Like panther battlegroup.

Toorstain wrote:
I would rather see it as a Non-doctrinal call-inn. Like panther battlegroup.

Thats Ok, but then you would have to make an expensive upgrade. That Tiger cant apear too early in the game.

If you make something normally buildable...it can't really be that good...as a capped one off callin in...we can cheese it up as much as we want really  ;)

well what if you made the Tiger a slightly less powerful attack but same armor? 700MP 150 Fuel 3 unit cap

Last edited February 17, 2010 at 5:49 PM by Zerstörer

Zerstörer wrote:
If you make something normally buildable...it can't really be that good...as a capped one off callin in...we can cheese it up as much as we want really  ;)

So there's only a small possibity to see them being buildable?
Thanks!  :)
Seriously, allowing the Ostheer to build Tigers would really take away from the Blitz-Doc of the WH, even if the OH-Tigers would be worse...

Aouch wrote:
Seriously, allowing the Ostheer to build Tigers would really take away from the Blitz-Doc of the WH, even if the OH-Tigers would be worse...

I thought Blitz is about the allmighty British killers - the stormrtoopers...

the Tiger tank was very often used Number of pieces: 1355

I don't think the Ostheer should have the Tiger one tank or the Panther as a build able unit. The Panther tanks are not needed if you play wisely. The Panzer elite Tank destroyer tactic makes the Panther tank useless, with the Hetzers and Jadgpanther. The Luftwaffe can use fallschirjager ad attack vehicles from behind with ease, not to metion the butterfly mine drop and HSC-129 strike. And the Scorched Earth could rely totally on the Hummel to destroy the enemy.

  The tiger tank, while its main role was in the Eastern front, it was not built in great numbers, so it could not be built in a factory. 

Quotewell what if you made the Tiger a slightly less powerful attack but same armor? 700MP 150 Fuel 3 unit cap

Then it would become a more expensive Panther you can spam in 2v2+ games....no point as it will serve the same purpose...German main heavy is the Panther...Tiger is the 'German special'

No, Tiger has to be a 'legend' like it was...aka in coh terms a super tank

Last edited February 17, 2010 at 5:51 PM by Zerstörer

Zerstörer wrote:

Quotewell what if you made the Tiger a slightly less powerful attack but same armor? 700MP 150 Fuel 3 unit cap

Then it would become a more expensive Panther you can spam in 2v2+ games....no point as it will serve the same purpose...German main heavy is the Panther...Tiger is the 'German special'
No, Tiger has to be a 'legend' like it was...aka in coh terms a super tank

Thats why I want a normal, very expensive (800MP/200Fuel) non veted Tiger I with a one on the field limit. There will be no spamming it.
A doctrinal a KT for the wermacht, Jagdpanther for PE and a Tiger ace (or an Elephant) for the Ostheer "can be a 'legend' like it was".
Or maybe 1 legendary unit per German fraction is not enough?

Can any mod please change the poll or start a new one?
Right now it doesn't make any sence at all.
It should be more like:

Do you want Tiger-tanks to be buildable for the Ostheer?

• Yes!


• No! Make them a Doctrin call-in instead.


• No! I don't want any Tiger for the Ostheer.

Last edited February 18, 2010 at 12:07 PM by Aouch

What if you want them to be call-inns, but non doctrinal? ;D

you should  just make them expensive.I.E.1000 MP, 100 MU, 200 F,pop 20 that way other players really have some time to prepare themselves. The Ostheer needs something heavier, or else people Will just play against them as the US to get heavy tanks and slaughter them.

IF the Tiger costs more than the IS-2 then it should perform better than the IS-2.

It usually does. I haven't tried it but I don't think the IS-2 can take out a tiger 1v1 my post was to resolve the "tweaking" matter, so the stats aren't modified, just the price.

okay the tiger, for gods sake.

Everybody wants it to be in the Ostheer,
but there has to be a solution which makes it
usefull and also non OP.

Thats the problem.

What are the suggestions which where actually made to
include the tiger IN the ostheer, let me think about it..


1.
the idea of putting it right in the Tank factory next to the panther.

-> the problem of this idea is that its too easy to get a tiger tank like this, because the tiger is still stronger than a IS2. Also no any german faction can build tigers, especially not right away.



2.
The idea of making it being a doctrinal call in. In gernal, a Tiger Ace. The black skin was mentioned several times, for example by me in my earlier concept ;)

-> This sounds probably like the best solution. BUT, this way the Wehr tiger would loose its coolness, because the Ace should be more compareable like a king tiger. In gernal, a upgraded tiger with special abilities.
This would probably kill the feeling of the wehr tiger.




3.
The 3rd solution was the idea of bringing it into your tank factory via a dotrinal late game upgrade. Tiger Number limited to 2 at the same time.


-> This idea comes with a lot of originality. It would rather be another doctrinal call in unit or just a big beast rolling out of your factories right away.
The disadvantage of this solution is, that its hard, i mean really hard to get a tiger like this. But hmmh, maybe its the best solution because remember, its still a tiger ;)



Just to clarify the tiger problem a bit,

//Venoxxis

Here is another option that solves the immediate problem and the Call on super tank problem, make it doctrine specific built out of the Tank Factory, this would eliminate the spam with a limit to 2-3 Tigers on the field and the early late game spam because you need to get the CPs for it...

you got it.
The best solotions in my eyes as well.
for the reasons of balance and originality !

Freakstar5 wrote:
the Tiger tank was very often used Number of pieces: 1355

As Freakstar5 stated there were 1355 Tigers built in the war and most of those were in the eastern front this is why i asked if allowing tigers to be built or called off map but more then "1 tank". Because I don't want 3 factions to have panthers, that's like having the Russians having the Sherman. I want different units for all 3 factions, and sins in the War the Tiger 1 wasn't really a super tank the germans super tank was the Maus( 2 only made it into battle) , King Tiger , JagdTiger, Elefant Tank, Sterm Tiger, and the landkreuzer p. 1000 ratte ( which was never completed, because of perduction was stopped in 1943).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzer_VIII_Maus

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landkreuzer_P._1000_Ratte

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_I

Last edited February 27, 2010 at 4:24 AM by Genzero

No maus that has been stated I wish people would stop bringing it up! and no only 3 where made and one made it to prototype testing phases and even the germans realized it was a waste of resources after the testing began... so no Maus and nothing of the other ridiculous Super Tanks that never made it off the drawing board

For the love of god, NO. NO NO NO NO NO NO NO.

NO.

For christs sake, this isn't Forgotten Hope Secret Weapons. No Mauses, no Rattes, no diesel powered combat mechs, just NO.

Venoxxis wrote:
okay the tiger, for gods sake.
the idea of putting it right in the Tank factory next to the panther.

Ostheer dosnt need a Panther. Wehrmacht can build them while PE can spam them.
Giving a Panther to Ostheer is like giving a lend-lease Sherman to Soviets.

Quote
The problem of this idea is that its too easy to get a tiger tank like this, because the tiger is still stronger than a IS2. Also no any german faction can build tigers, especially not right away.

Then make it more expensive than IS-2 with a 1 on the field limit. 750MP 180fuel.

Quote
The idea of making it being a doctrinal call in. In gernal, a Tiger Ace. This sounds probably like the best solution. BUT, this way the Wehr tiger would loose its coolness, because the Ace should be more compareable like a king tiger. In gernal, a upgraded tiger with special abilities.
This would probably kill the feeling of the wehr tiger.

Vet III tiger will never loose its feeling.
Ostheer also needs an Elephant doctrinal unit.

Quote
The 3rd solution was the idea of bringing it into your tank factory via a dotrinal late game upgrade. Tiger Number limited to 2 at the same time.

Thats not a solution. If 65% want it out of factories, they want to have it in every doctrine and can pay even 800MP/200Fuel for it. Only 17% wants it as a doctrinal unit (Tiger ace).

Heres my solution:
1. Buildable Tiger. 1 on the field limit. 750MP 180fuel.
2. Doctrinal Tiger ace or Elephant (or both in different doctrines)
3. No Panthers and PzIVs.
4. PzIII, StugIII and JagdpanzerIV as medium armor support.

Its all in my doctrine:
http://easternfront.org/forums/index.php?topic=2681.0
I think its balanced. Without Panthers and PzIVs Ostheer will be unique and different than Wehrmacht/PE tactics will be needed to play it.

Paciat wrote:

Quote
The 3rd solution was the idea of bringing it into your tank factory via a dotrinal late game upgrade. Tiger Number limited to 2 at the same time.

Thats not a solution. If 65% want it out of factories, they want to have it in every doctrine and can pay even 800MP/200Fuel for it. Only 17% wants it as a doctrinal unit (Tiger ace).

Actually my idea would satisfy everyone, people who want it to be built can get it to build... BUT at the same time it is  doctrine specific so it satisfies the Doctrinal unit people...

hgghg4 wrote:

Paciat wrote:

Quote
The 3rd solution was the idea of bringing it into your tank factory via a dotrinal late game upgrade. Tiger Number limited to 2 at the same time.

Thats not a solution. If 65% want it out of factories, they want to have it in every doctrine and can pay even 800MP/200Fuel for it. Only 17% wants it as a doctrinal unit (Tiger ace).

Actually my idea would satisfy everyone, people who want it to be built can get it to build... BUT at the same time it is  doctrine specific so it satisfies the Doctrinal unit people...

People dont want to get it build. People want it in every doctrine. Russians have their command squad in early game, Ostheer would have their Tiger I tank in the late game.(If they can afford it)
Less than 20% wants it as a doctrinal unit, some think about the tiger like they do about the PE panther battlegroup - but then it would be too easy to get.

I voted off map because making it build-able would break the other tigers being off map.

Maybe they should take awhile to create, that would make it closer to being historically accurate and more fair for other players.
You guys are complaining about other factions not being able to build Tigers , well the entire point of the Ostheer was to make it UNIQUE

Amen brother Amen!

Akalonor wrote:
Maybe they should take awhile to create, that would make it closer to being historically accurate and more fair for other players.
You guys are complaining about other factions not being able to build Tigers , well the entire point of the Ostheer was to make it UNIQUE

Couldnt agree more, Im sick of these people claiming that the off map Tigers make it unique, but the truth is: Make the tigers biuldable, something new, something......unique!

I think it has to be off-map.

Though I think it maybe should be possible to get it through a factory, but it must come from off the map, and be limited. This is because some of the "magic" of the heavy tanks is that they must be called in and also because of the point of soviet being the only one who can get several heavy tanks.

And if you wonder, I don't like soviet having IS-2s coming out of factories, either.

Hmm,  not a bad concept, but what would the difference be other then call in time from a doctrinal call on?

Maybe like all docs can call them like the PE after some perquisites?

I smell spam?

you rang?

those are panthers, it is hard to find pictures of multiple tigers but I happen to have one. Even with PE though how can you spam something that costs 1000 MP?

SauerKRAUT wrote:
those are panthers, it is hard to find pictures of multiple tigers but I happen to have one. Even with PE though how can you spam something that costs 1000 MP?

2 Panther BG call-ins and you have a spam. Nobody said it has to be a 1vs1 game. Even PzIV/Cromwell spamming is more difficult (fuel).

You need to go through a crudload of fuel and MP first though, even without other vehicles and infantry upgrades it is at least 235 fuel and a couple k MP, you would not survive that way and it is something that is kinda earned if you can make it that long especially against soviets 1v1 with PE I have yet to see that day...

SauerKRAUT wrote:
those are panthers, it is hard to find pictures of multiple tigers but I happen to have one. Even with PE though how can you spam something that costs 1000 MP?

when you get to late game panther spam can get ridiculous at times.