Unit stats ingame

Hi guys,

I was thinking that one of the things we have not done something about is the ingame stats for each unit, that chart located below the unit portrait or critical, that represent the effectivity vs the type of unit.



No matter most of you think that they are not worth the time because are inaccurate, other people say it is needed and our faction has them messed up; the truth is that Relic added such stats ingame, and is our duty to make soviets and in the future the ostheer to reflect these stats correctly as well.

At the moment, some units have their correct data, others not, others after getting an upgrade gets an incorrect data, so I would like to ask your help to catch the units that needs to fix it. Also, feel free to suggest the input values you think it deserves.

---

Updated Units:

* Ingeneries & Sturmovies
* Commissar Squad
* Conscripts
* Strelky
* Guards
* Mortars
* Mechanics
* Tank Hunters
* Partisans
* ZiS atgs
* T70
* T90
* T-34/76
* T-34/85
* IS-2
* IS-3
* KV-1
* KV-2
* KV-85
* SU-85
* SU-76
* SU-122
* ISU-152

Last edited January 6, 2012 at 4:57 PM by blackbishop

Maybe CS should be changed. ATM IIRC it says 2 in the vs infantry slot. Maybe it should be 3

And since conscripts kinda suck, maybe we should lower it to 1 :P

And IIRC T-34 and T-34 with 85 mm upgrade have same stats. I think it should be changed to notify players they're tanks are that much better :P

Last edited December 27, 2011 at 12:40 AM by Fishhunterx

The IS-3 stats have all ingame stats are 8, shouldn't it be 9?

IS-3 should be 9 vs all except for buildings.

Ok, changed UI stats for:
* Commissar Squad
* Conscripts
* T-34/85
* IS-3

Thanks guys :D.

Yay, I helped

blackbishop wrote:
* Commissar Squad

Shouldn't it be command squad?

Meh, that's a nickname :P.

Let's see, imo:

Command Squad: 3 (+2 with PPS 43) / 0 / 0 / 0
Ingenery: 1 / 0 / 0 / 0

Conscript: 1 (+1 with extra rifles) / 0 / 0 / 0
Strelky: 2 (+2 with extra weapons) / 0 / 0 / 0
Guards: 3 (+1 with shock) / 0 / 0 / 0

Sharpshooter: 1 (+8 with sniper kit) / 0 / 0 / 0
Mortar: Whatever the WH mortar has (+1 against building & infantry for heavy)
Tank Hunters: 1 / 3 (+3 with double PTRD) / 2 (+2 with double PTRD) / 1 (+1 with dobuel PTRD)
AT Gun: Whatever the US AT Gun has

T-70: 2 / 4 / 4 / 1  (or something like this?)
T-90: 5 / 1 / 0 / 0  (infantry value up/down?)
T-34/76: 4 / 4 / 4 / 3
T-34/85: 5 / 7 / 7 / 4
KV-1: 4 / 5 / 5 / 3
KV-85: 5 / 8 / 8 / 4
IS-2: Whatever Panther has +/- 1


feedback plax.

Long time ago i made topic about this http://easternfront.org/forums/index.php?topic=6511.0 . But good to see that you're working on it, because that was annoying me since 1.0 version.

Rizz wrote:
Let's see, imo:

Command Squad: 3 (+2 with PPS 43) / 0 / 0 / 0
Ingenery: 1 (+2 Sturmovie) / 0 / 0 / 0

Conscript: 1 (+1 with extra rifles) / 0 / 0 / 0
Strelky: 2 (+2 with extra weapons) / 0 / 0 / 0
Guards: 4 (+1 with shock) / 0 / 0 / 0

Sharpshooter: 1 (+8 with sniper kit) (+6 with Observer) / 0  / 0 / 0 (+6 with Observer)
Mortar: Whatever the WH mortar has (+2 against building & infantry for heavy)
Tank Hunters: 1 / 3 (+3 with double PTRD) / 2 (+2 with double PTRD) / 1
AT Gun: Whatever the US AT Gun has

T-70: 2 / 4 / 4 / 1  (or something like this?)
T-90: 5 / 3 / 1 / 3  (infantry value up/down?)
T-34/76: 4 / 4 / 4 / 3
T-34/85: 4 / 7 / 7 / 3
KV-1: 4 / 5 / 5 / 3
KV-85: 4 / 8 / 8 / 4
IS-2: Whatever Panther has +/- 1


feedback plax.

Edited to my accordance.

This crap doesn't even matter anyway if you know how to use units specifically.

The aim of the mod is to make it look like a unofficial relic addon. It does matter alot.

Can´t make suggestions now, have to look at corsix and current stats of other factions first.

Should the Ingenery stats be higher with Sturmiove? They're bpretty strong once you get the upgrade and flamers :P

Shouldn't the IS-2 be having AT damage as 7?

Fishhunterx wrote:
Should the Ingenery stats be higher with Sturmiove? They're bpretty strong once you get the upgrade and flamers :P

+1 :D

The Sharpshooter gains a + 2 to vehicle and +1 to tank when he gets the Marksman Rifle upgrade (becomes a real Sniper), I think that should be fixed too :P

I understand this subject is a big deal, but what I do not understand is what exactly all those numbers mean O_o

I never really understood the underlaying mechanics of CoH I guess.

Dot.Shadow wrote:
I understand this subject is a big deal, but what I do not understand is what exactly all those numbers mean O_o

I never really understood the underlaying mechanics of CoH I guess.

The numbers have no fucking correlation with the actual game mechanics. They are there to look pretty and give noobs a general idea on how stuff matches up. I think we're wasting time thinking about it but w/e

Lax buddy, take out your anger on a pillow. Noobs may be something that many of the higher players dislike but they must still be part of the gaming community. They need guidance too

neosdark wrote:
Lax buddy, take out your anger on a pillow. Noobs may be something that many of the higher players dislike but they must still be part of the gaming community. They need guidance too

The noobs are a good part of the community. I did not mean any disrespect or hatred towards them as they're learning the game. I just think that it's kind of pointless to be wasting our time adjusting numbers for show rather than balancing.

@Cranialwizard
Could you stop overrecting?

I ask the help of everyone to get this right, due to being better than making private, the more people than can report this, the faster we finish this part. I don't really understand your attitude, so should we do with our time what you demand? If you don't consider this necessary, means that it shall not be done? and now this somehow delays balancing?

This should be done and I don't really think that we spent a lot of resources changing some numbers for the layout. As several comrades already stated, this must be done, and the sooner the better. No matter if this is "noob stuff" it has a place on Eastern Front. The other balancers know what they are doing, we are glad they are helping us with balance but that doesn't mean they should be testing 24/7.

---

Btw, I have fixed the entries for the aforementioned units. One note, for every slot weapon given to a unit sums up the values, e.g. Command Squad has 3/1/0/0 but when purchasing the PPS it gets 3+5/1/0/0 because every weapon has 1/0/0/0 (five times this is 5/0/0/0 ) so, we will need to create different weapons to get the proposed 3+2/1/0/0, add one weapon two times that has the 1/0/0/0 and three times one with zero values. Probably it is not worthy :)... unless you want this, it is very easy, but you can say will duplicate files.

blackbishop wrote:
@Cranialwizard
Could you stop overrecting?

I ask the help of everyone to get this right, due to being better than making private, the more people than can report this, the faster we finish this part. I don't really understand your attitude, so should we do with our time what you demand? If you don't consider this necessary, means that it shall not be done? and now this somehow delays balancing?

This should be done and I don't really think that we spent a lot of resources changing some numbers for the layout. As several comrades already stated, this must be done, and the sooner the better. No matter if this is "noob stuff" it has a place on Eastern Front. The other balancers know what they are doing, we are glad they are helping us with balance but that doesn't mean they should be testing 24/7.

---

Btw, I have fixed the entries for the aforementioned units. One note, for every slot weapon given to a unit sums up the values, e.g. Command Squad has 3/1/0/0 but when purchasing the PPS it gets 3+5/1/0/0 because every weapon has 1/0/0/0 (five times this is 5/0/0/0 ) so, we will need to create different weapons to get the proposed 3+2/1/0/0, add one weapon two times that has the 1/0/0/0 and three times one with zero values. Probably it is not worthy :)... unless you want this, it is very easy, but you can say will duplicate files.

You're right. I apologize for the reaction.

However not sure that adding slot weapons for 1/0/0/0 is very smart because of the large squad upgrades (like RBS. That adds 6 PPSHs at one point...sorta high anti-infantry values)

Volks have similar "stats" after getting MP40s.

Maybe give Strelky only +4 or +5 after they get PPSH? Giving them 2+6/0/0/0 seems a tad high. Thats higher than a Puma IIRC  :P. Maybe even as high as an Ostwind :-X

Also IIRC Strelky get 2+2/0/0/0 after they get DPSH lmgs (not sure if thats the correct name, you get the idea). Maybe it should be changed to +3 or +4. Unless they actually aren't that powerful. I wouldn't know  :P

rgr, for the next patch they will get +5 and changed dp28 to +4

Shouldn't  strelky have base infanty damage as 3? They have seven rifles initially which do good amounts of damage.

Ya but horrid health which knocks them down a peg.

They have 7 rifles but who says they are accurate? Or that they even do decent dmg? And their health kinda sucks like conscripts so yeah :P

What about Su-122? Maybe it should has same numbers as StuH 42 has?

I thought the SU-122 dealt more dmg ???

Last edited December 28, 2011 at 12:51 PM by Fishhunterx

it does

I have another suggestion. Since conscripts stats will not be 1/0/0/0, maybe they should be changed to 1+1/0/0/0 when penal battalion is purchased :P.

BTW what does rgr mean ???

Conscripts already have 1/0/0/0. But after getting the extra rifles they will get 1+N/0/0/0.

whats the N stand for ???

In math, N is the max amount of something; in this case N =Total of rifles adquired with "For the Motherland".

1+4/0/0/0  ??? Since they gain 4 rifles and N is their max amount then this is correct yes? Seems a bit high dont you think?  :P

Indeed, it is a bit high.

IMO it would be better with 1+2/0/0 whaddya think?

Yeah, I think that should work.

IMO thats still kinda high. Stelky rifles do more dmg then conscript rifles and they have 7 rifles, yet their stats are 2/0/0/0. Conscripts have weaker rifles and have 8 but they will have 1+2/0/0/0. It's kinda of like saying conscripts are stronger or at least better at killing infantry when they're probably not  :P

When you pay 50 muni for 4 rifles, it should seem that you are getting some bang for your buck.

They aren't better than Strelky, so they can't get more than that.

The SU marksman when upgraded to sniper shows a +2 damage for vehicles & a +3 damage for tanks.

Yeah, already pointed out and fixed, thanks :D!

---

Updated units:

* Ingeneries & Sturmovies
* Commissar Squad
* Conscripts
* Strelky
* Guards
* Mortars
* Mechanics
* Tank Hunters
* ZiS atgs
* T70
* T90
* T-34/76
* T-34/85
* IS-2
* IS-3
* KV-1
* KV-85

Last edited January 3, 2012 at 5:17 AM by blackbishop

Slightly OT but is the soviet AI not being able to move dug in AT guns fixed?

yes

Is the SU-85 discussed already?If not I can give some help here...

I think SU-85 could use some identical stats from either StuG IV or M10 Tank Destroyer with some variations  :P

Could you change the marksman to show 7 dmg VS. infantry? IMO 9 is a bit high

All Snipers have 9 don't they?

Yes, they do.

If I remember right the partisans have 7 against infantry. Seems a little to good for an group of armed civilians if you ask me ;P

Well they have 2 ppsh, 1 mp40, 1 mosin and 1 kar98 if i good remember. Maybe 6 vs infantry would good as they don't wield 5 submachines.