Campaign Structure

I agree , it shouldnt all be base building , but if there is an eastern fronts campaign , IT NEEDS BASE BUILDING MISSIONS. if it has none then it will end up more like dawn of war 2 which is terrible.

Dawn of War 2 *Sigh*

Wish it was like Dawn of War the 1st series ( Including soulstorm)

But the campaigns for both army best place 1 or 2 main heroes what do you think?

Certainly, little that means my opinion, but I will say. Let us do without a transatlantic delirium. you will not be able to contain all of this war in one company. I suggest to divide it into a few parts and produce in turn.

1  Blickrig- summer company of 1941, sudden assault on the USSR. Chaos, disorder, surroundings of soviet troops, first fight with T-34, defensive of Smolensk, battle for Moscow.

2 Stalingrad- defensive on approaches, barrage detachments NKVD (but shooting were rare, almost always soldiers were returned back, often treated shots in air), fights for every meter of earth, heroic defensive of Stalingrad, surroundings and elimination 6 armies of German.

3 Kursk battle- defensive of 3 lines of strengthening (it is possible to create even missions on creation of strengthening and mining), counterblows of soviet tank corps, breach of the last border of defensive (Prokhorovka)  the German troops of SS, largest tank battle under Prokhorovkoy, surroundings of the German tank divisions of SS, battle for Kharkov.

4 Forcing of Dnepr- battle for Ukraine, liberation of Kiev and other cities.

5 Operation of Bagration- the brilliant planned operation of giving orders to the USSR and Stalin in strict secrecy. Liberation of Byelorussia one quick as lightning blow.

6 Germany, Poland and Berlin- liberation of Poland, battles in Germanium, assault of Zelovskikh of heights, battle for Berlin.

Can I help, missions are created in the editor of maps?

Last edited May 31, 2010 at 6:07 PM by InkvizitoR_51rus

Mates, I don't get it... So when is EF placed in time? In years 1941-1945, or just 1944? In vCoH it's easy to guess, but in EF?
I think that making "1941-45" campaign is not so good as it seems. Leningrad, Stalingrad, Kursk, Berlin... You want all of them in one campaign. Just look at vCoH campaigns - US and Brits campaign is not "whole war campaign". Soviet campaign should focus on one, maybe two big battles - let's say Stalingrad and Kursk, or last 12 months of war - operation Bagration and straight through the Poland to Berlin.

You misunderstood me. I said that it would be better to split the company into several smaller ones. Company about 1941, the company has about Stalingrad, Kursk, about the company and so on.

-Bout Enemy at the Gates---> In the trash


Modified

Sincerly

Apologies for not making further research
Sorry for the trouble

Last edited June 1, 2010 at 8:22 AM by ImperialKaskins

This is nonsense, and not a movie. Units of the NKVD had already existed. Rifles were many. And most importantly, the Soviet troops fought a defensive war, but not offensive. The Soviet soldiers in Stalingrad, no rifles, they were given automatic "PPSH" and flamethrowers for urban fighting. The fighting there were in each house.The Germans fought for one house, more than Poland, but for one street more than the whole of France. The one who smarter and smarter. Very important was the unarmed combat, our soldiers used a sharp spade. The Germans did not like the melee, and all the forces wanted to avoid. In Stalingrad, several Soviet divisions kept the whole German army.

.. I see. Looks like another 1 in a trash bin

I propose to use the beautiful moments and ideas from the Soviet and Russian films.

I propose to use the Russian documentaries. UeArtemis, you watched the series "Great War"?

I'm curious why nearly every thread in the last time quickly turns into an "Enemy at the Gates"-hate-thread.

I think it's OK to tell the DEVs once, that the way soviet soldiers are depicted is EFmod are an "insult" to some russian people.
But then the DEVs explained more than once that EFmod wants to keep the "spirit of vCoH", meaning that not everything has to be completly realistic and that they choose entertainment over historical accuracy.



In the end, I just couldn't resist to comment the article:

The way the author starts, looks like he thinks that Saving Private Ryan is realistic in some way, which is just plain bullshit.
Then he goes on to rant about uniforms, ranks and names and seems to completly forget that this movie is for the avarage western viewer, who has no clue about such things and propably gets confused if they were too realistic or even worse: He won't find the movie cool. After all it's still a commercial project, not a historical documentary.

He justify his rant against the NKVD "blocking detachment" with "In Rome, they did it do!", which is just no argument. Or should we forget about the KZs because of soviet Gulags?
May it be my little knowledge of the English language, but he never said that NKVD "blocking detachments" didn't existed and it seems that the author realist that such things actually happened and he therefore couldn't say "bloody lie".

I also find it funny when he believed that every russian inhabitant was a "good communist" and never cared for their own life but all for Mother Russia's wealth. (I refer to the lines about "Sasha's mother".)

...

Last edited June 1, 2010 at 9:17 AM by Aouch

Full delirium, brain washing in the west is in full swing. The Soviet people fought to a man against his will. And what was he to do? None of the people of the world could not endure that made our nation. 27 million dead, and of these only 8 million were killed at the front. 19-20 million civilians were killed by the Nazis. Old men, women and children, this horror was not in the history of mankind. What are we supposed to do but fight? Our country has constantly been in ruins, half of the world has come to our land with arms in their hands. If necessary, we will defend segdnya whine country from you, or Chinese. Your statements about the fun and laughter are an insult to our people and our victory. Do not you have won this war, we stopped the German army, to us, no one could beat her.

Totally off topic,

But the most devastating losses from the Allies in WW2 were suffered by Greece, that's if you take in mind the percentages of total population/losses.

:(

InkvizitoR_51rus wrote:
I propose to use the Russian documentaries. UeArtemis, you watched the series "Great War"?

No, I don't. But I like the "Hot Snow".

Did Relic see Soviet films? :) Commandos on the River
Commandos on the River

Last edited June 1, 2010 at 10:15 AM by UeArtemis

The crossing of the Dnieper from the "Liberation"? One of the bloodiest battles of the war, I would have devoted to this battle, and each such separate company.

I'm sorry if I insulted you and Russia, InkvizitoR_51rus. I never had the intention to do so. I also never wanted to deny that Russia and all other Nazi-occupied countries suffered a lot under Hitler and his followers.  :(
I also think that soviet Russia was the main factor to final end the Third Reich.

However, I can't understand why some Russians today still believe every Russian in that time, 70 years ago, "fought for their land" and never spent a single thought on his own life and wealth. This would of course also mean, that maybe there were Russians who worked together with the Axis, because of their own life, were forced to do so or they simply didn't agree with Stalin and his policy...



BTW: Even if Relic watched Soviet films, it wouldn't matter. Relic didn't created the Red Army, nore the Eastern Front in CoH. A brilliant mod team did and still do that. :)

I mean, the other Russian mentality. We used to work and serve for their country, and not for themselves. Perhaps it is negative by our side. When the Soviet Union collapsed, Russia and other countries have begun to chaos.
Now the country's corruption, the government does not care about us, army and navy collapse. All sold, pensions and wages are low. This is what happens to us if we have democracy in the country, in Russia simply can not be democracy. Better to let a leader with brains than a herd of dumb asses, officials, stealing our money. The largest and resource-rich country, and live in poverty.
That is why democracy we do not like. Most importantly, our dignity, to rise in one breath, fight together against the invaders, which is why no one could have won.

Returning to the subject company. For the majority of Russian, this war is sacred, and many pity that the developers let the mass of our guys on the machine guns. What prevents them from doing our group and the company is realistic? The balance will suffer?

Not so bad it was. In my native Ukraine was relatively good after the collapse of the Soviet Union, unlike in other countries, where were civil wars, rebellions. Only in the 21 century the Orange Revolution came and then troubles began. But this is offtopic.

Yes, it is really the sacred war for most of ex-Soviet people. Usually in the CIS people for whom this war is "alien", have an ideology what is close to Nazism. (Ultranationalism, not confuse with nationalism and patriotism)
In the east people wait to see how developers will make this heroic, sacred atmosphere.

Last edited June 2, 2010 at 11:11 AM by UeArtemis

Yushchenko is nice you have in Ukraine annealed. We all fear was in 1990-2003. My father, Russian army officer, lived in a remote garrison in the north. Penny was paid $ 150 a month salary of a Russian officer rank of Captain. Money for food was not, eating a potato.
Okay, let's not about sad. I have engaged a company has good experience from other games. And with what it do? Map editor?

Ющенко конечно хорошо у вас на Украине отжигал. У нас вообще ужас был в 1990-2003 годах. Мой отец- офицер российской армии, жили в дальнем гарнизоне на севере. Платили копейки- 150$ в месяц зарплата российского офицера звания Капитан. Интересно сколько зарабатывают офицеры США. Денег на еду не было, ели одну картошку.
Ладно, не будем о грустном. Я бы занялся компанией, опыт благо есть из других игр. А с помощью чего её делать? Редактора карт?

There is a built-in map editor and manuals in English, which can be found on the official Relic forums.

P.S. Ah, I remember, I ate cod liver in 1992 :) every day :)

Jesus, people, stop being so butthurt. Eastern Front is not a simulator, and Enemy at the Gates was not a documentary. Stop being all indignant and all "THIS IS AN INSULT TO MOTHER RUSSIA!"

According to the media, WWII American soldiers were all uneducated peasants led by blood-thirsty officers, the French were cowardly cheese-eating surrendering monkeys (or blood-thirsty cheese-eating psychopaths when they are the Resistance), the British were tea-sipping douchebags, the Canadians... were not even there, and the Japs and the Germans... the less we talk about them, the better.

But we take it all in good stride because... this is a video-game. Not a text book in our schools.



Explain why the devs of Eastern Front, a mod made for fun with no economic support behind, based on Company of Heroes, an unrealistic, fast-paced RTS with base building and "GERMAN STEEL!"-screaming Nagtsis, should bend backwards to your wishes and make a realistic representation of what you think Russia was like back then.

Which was probably not any close to what you think anyway.

If you want something different from what the mod offers, here is an idea: LEARN TO CODE, AND MAKE YOUR OWN MOD.

back about campaign, and super-heroism ?

why not altern one sov mission and one germ mission ?

the campaign i ever saw is not history but starcraft1 by the way, where unit are gradually deployed, army suffer while working their aim, against time and casualties, on goood maps
and doctrines are here to choose the style

OFF-TOPIC

The Mod in itself follows the guidelines of what Company of Heroes is all about. I have no complaints except that nobody online is ever playing it.

ON-TOPIC

My idea:

RED ARMY FACTION : LEVEL I
I. Back, Back, Back

I. Operation Barbarossa is in full effect. Comrade Stalin was caught napping and now the Soviets are paying for it. Soviet infantry on occupied Poland are being slaughtered left right by the Luftwaffe and the incoming Panzer Groups. The mission here is two-fold. Survive, and, as ordered by your superiors, ensure as many of your brethren survive as possible.

Objectives
1. Maintain the Front as long as possible while other units retreat. (4 minutes)
2. Hold back the Wehrmacht from taking the road as long as possible.
3. Retreat back to the junction and hold it as long as possible.

Secondary Objectives
1. Protect Comrade Kuzichinko's damaged T-34 until its repaired.

And that will be kind of the " How the Soviet's play " level.

Last edited June 23, 2010 at 4:27 AM by Theodorable

Saavedra wrote:
Jesus, people, stop being so butthurt. Eastern Front is not a simulator, and Enemy at the Gates was not a documentary. Stop being all indignant and all "THIS IS AN INSULT TO MOTHER RUSSIA!"

According to the media, WWII American soldiers were all uneducated peasants led by blood-thirsty officers, the French were cowardly cheese-eating surrendering monkeys (or blood-thirsty cheese-eating psychopaths when they are the Resistance), the British were tea-sipping douchebags, the Canadians... were not even there, and the Japs and the Germans... the less we talk about them, the better.

But we take it all in good stride because... this is a video-game. Not a text book in our schools.



Explain why the devs of Eastern Front, a mod made for fun with no economic support behind, based on Company of Heroes, an unrealistic, fast-paced RTS with base building and "GERMAN STEEL!"-screaming Nagtsis, should bend backwards to your wishes and make a realistic representation of what you think Russia was like back then.

Which was probably not any close to what you think anyway.

If you want something different from what the mod offers, here is an idea: LEARN TO CODE, AND MAKE YOUR OWN MOD.

They arent "all indignant", they are just noticing some fact.
I'm French and I never hear media saying "WWII American soldiers were all uneducated peasants led by blood-thirsty officers, the French were cowardly cheese-eating surrendering monkeys (or blood-thirsty cheese-eating psychopaths when they are the Resistance), the British were tea-sipping douchebags, the Canadians... were not even there". Its only "joke" prejudice about these soldier.

Of course in France we have our prejudice about "La France Résistante", "la pause thé des Anglais" and others... But in fact we know that without the help of Commonwealth, USA and Resistance, France would be a sad part of Germany. We know precisely how the war was in the West, and I think that other allied nation know this too. But we dont know so much about the fight in the East. I remember that a History teacher tell me in my highschool that the soviet DID fight in Stalingrad with 1 rifle for 2 men (!!!!) , according to recent work of western historian (just like Beevor), and that "red army was a bunch of uneducated communist savage" (almost the same sentence as you Saavedra, funny ist'n it?). I was certain he was about to glorify Werhmacht...

I understand that EF is a (well-made) mod made without economic support behind, and dev want people to play it with fun. But it would be interesting if we can have a more "realistic" campaign, without western prejudice about USSR and Red Army. I know these from plenty of other game about this, and for me its going to be boring  :( There are some good idea here about both german and soviet side, I hope dev will pick up these for the campaign  :D

The devs will probaby make it more focused of entertainment value rather than historical accuracy. If it was based solely on history CoH would be a heck of a lot less fun than it is. Point being war isnt all that its cracked up to be. So sit back and trust the devs to make a good compromise. Its nothing to get worked up about.

I dont know if s1 posted something similar in here, i didnt want to read through all of the pages ;)
But how about a Campaign based on the Film Duell-Enemy at the Gates.

Your Mission is to Kill the German Sharpshooter. You will only have 1 Unit, your Sniper Ace (Wassili Saizew) and have to eliminate serveral Targets, Officers, MG-Crews, Mortars... Well then you meet your Oponent (Scharfschütze König), and of course you have to eliminate him. Now so that it gets challenging König could get the health of a Captain from OF, he wouldnt be 1 shot dead like that. But you will have to watch for enemy soldiers witch could spot you, so you will have to move. Then wait until enemy sniper moves a tiny bit so you spot him (could be done by leaving camo for 1 or 2 sec). You have to fire out of cover otherwise you get uncapped (idk if possible).

Well only a rogh concept of a Campaign but maybe usable.

I think a campaign covering the key points in the German invasion of Russia would be suited. 

Choosing where to start and finish it will be difficult, but i do know that Berlin, Stalingrad and Kursk should be covered.

IMO< the major battles i'd like to see would be...

1941: Minsk
1942: Moscow, Leningrad, Stalingrad early
1943: Stalingrad, Kursk
1944: Steamroll through Poland, Siege on Budapest,
1945: Seelow Hieghts, Berlin.

I think that the best idea would be to wait until Ostheer comes out. Then think about campaign like that: Ostheer campaign 1941-1943 ( to Kursk battle) and then Soviet one 1943-1945.

I got some ideas:

Level 1: your command squad and a couple of conscript squads are in trenches when they hear the germans have invaded the SU, now you have to fight off some german attacks.
After a few minutes the german tanks come and you will be forced to retreat to a defensive line further to east. some ZIS-2s will be waiting there and together with some cpu allies you can hold the line. If the major dies the mission will have failed.
After fighting off the attacks a german plane will come and wounds the major/commisar, then the mission ends.

Level 2: After waking up the major finds himself in a hospital in moscow, just when the battle for the city is beginning.
ignoring all advice he and a few upgraded conscript squads will get to the front line and assist the other forces defending moscow. just as the germans have a breakthrough some t-34s will arrive and the cpu ally will force the gemans to retreat.
unless before that time the lines of the players side has collapsed than the mission has failed.

Level 3:
After his heroic defense of moscow the major has been promoted and controlles the whole south-west front.
In october 1942 the germans launch an attack on stalingrad.
meanwhile the t-34 production has increased greatly, so the cpu and the player will have a few t-34s at the beginning of the game.
for the most part you will have conscripts but now you will also have strelky.
the first defensive line is just outside the city and is offmap.
the second line of defense will be manned by the cpu.
the third line of defense is for the player.
not having enough troops to fully garrison the line the player will have to make a choise:
spread the force over the whole line.
or defend a part of the line.
After the second line collapses the third line will be everything that stands in the way of the germans advance in the south. If the germans break through the third line and reach the volga, before operation uranus, the encirclement of the 6th army,  is launched, you will be defeated.

Level 4:
After they're painfull defeat in stalingrad the germans launch operation citadel, te last desperate attempt to defeat the soviets. this time the germans wil have panthers and tigers,
but, again, the t-34 production has increased an you will have a lot of t-34s. this time you will not have conscripts but only strelky and guards. you will have to defend the area untill the german are out of reserves, you will get 1 t-34 every 5 minutes as reinforcements. if all of your troops will be destroyed or if you lose too much ground the mission will have failed.
the last german attack wave will be some panthers and a tiger. if you beat off that wave, the germans are forced to retreat to the west.

Level 5:
The Crimean offensive:
Following their defeats at stalingrad and kursk, the germans have been driven back to the west.
And now the Crimean penninsular is cut-off from the rest of army-group south, and the 17th army is trapped.
the last defendible piece of land is the area arround Sevastopol, but the germans are dug-in in defensive lines and aren't going to give up without a fight.
its the players task to break all german resistence on the penninsular, you have to break trough the final line off defense.
if broken the germans are forced to evacuate. if the stavka thinks you have taken too much time to do so the mission has failed.

Level 6:
After the allmost entire annhialation of army group center, it's the players task to force a critical breaktrough against a collapsed front, therefore you must reach the Oder river, but the germans have blown-up all but one bridges.
You must secure this bridge and defend it against the last desparate counter-attack, with allmost all the german panzer-reserves. if you can hold this brigde the germans can only retreat and berlin will be a bit closer.

Level 7:
After their retreat throuh poland the germans are determined to make a last stand just outside of berlin. this time they will be on the defense. seelow is the last line of defense, if you can break this line the way to berlin will be open. you start with strelky, guards, t-34s and t-34-85s.
you must break the seelow line. if all german resistence is crushed you win, if you loose al your tanks you will be defeated.

Level 8:
After the fall of the seelow line the germans are fleeing to the west, the only way to stop them is the encirclement of berlin. you and your allies must break all resistence and join the other russian forces coming from the other side.

Level 9:
Berlin, april 1945.
You must destroy all 88s near the brandenburger tor and the reichstag, but first you have to clean the surrounding streets of germans, mostly volksgrenadiers. after this the way to the reichtag is open and you will be victorious but the germans have a nasty supprise for you: 3 88s on the square in front of the reichstag. you mst destroy them before the time is up, or all your tanks are destroyed, after the destruction of the 88s you must get a squad of infantry into the reichstag. then the germans are defeated and you will become a hero of the soviet union.

Maybe its not 100% historical correct but this is my idea of the soviet campaign.

Last edited August 16, 2010 at 1:45 PM by KennyEft1

KennyEft1 wrote:
I got some ideas:
Level 1: your command squad and a couple of conscript squads are in trenches when they hear the germans have invaded the SU, now you have to fight off some german attacks.
After a few minutes the german tanks come and you will be forced to retreat to a defensive line further to east. some ZIS-2s will be waiting there and together with some cpu allies you can hold the line. If the major dies the mission will have failed.
After fighting off the attacks a german plane will come and wounds the major/commisar, then the mission ends.

Level 2: After waking up the major finds himself in a hospital in moscow, just when the battle for the city is beginning.
ignoring all advice he and a few upgraded conscript squads will get to the front line and assist the other forces defending moscow. just as the germans have a breakthrough some t-34s will arrive and the cpu ally will force the gemans to retreat.
unless before that time the lines of the players side has collapsed than the mission has failed.

Level 3:
After his heroic defense of moscow the major has been promoted and controlles the whole south-west front.
In october 1942 the germans launch an attack on stalingrad.
meanwhile the t-34 production has increased greatly, so the cpu and the player will have a few t-34s at the beginning of the game.
for the most part you will have conscripts but now you will also have strelky.
the first defensive line is just outside the city and is offmap.
the second line of defense will be manned by the cpu.
the third line of defense is for the player.
not having enough troops to fully garrison the line the player will have to make a choise:
spread the force over the whole line.
or defend a part of the line.
After the second line collapses the third line will be everything that stands in the way of the germans advance in the south. If the germans break through the third line and reach the volga, before operation uranus, the encirclement of the 6th army,  is launched, you will be defeated.

Level 4:
After they're painfull defeat in stalingrad the germans launch operation citadel, te last desperate attempt to defeat the soviets. this time the germans wil have panthers and tigers,
but, again, the t-34 production has increased an you will have a lot of t-34s. this time you will not have conscripts but only strelky and guards. you will have to defend the area untill the german are out of reserves, you will get 1 t-34 every 5 minutes as reinforcements. if all of your troops will be destroyed or if you lose too much ground the mission will have failed.
the last german attack wave will be some panthers and a tiger. if you beat off that wave, the germans are forced to retreat to the west.

Level 5:
After their retreat throuh poland the germans are determined to make a last stand just outside of berlin. this time they will be on the defense. seelow is the last line of defense, if you can break this line the way to berlin will be open. you start with strelky, guards, t-34s and t-34-85s.
you must break the seelow line. if all german resistence is crushed you win, if you loose al your tanks you will be defeated.

Level 6:
After the fall of the seelow line the germans are fleeing to the west, the only way to stop them is the encirclement of berlin. you and your allies must break all resistence and join the other russian forces coming from the other side.

Level 7:
Berlin, april 1945.
You must destroy all 88s near the brandenburger tor and the reichstag, but first you have to clean the surrounding streets of germans, mostly volksgrenadiers. after this the way to the reichtag is open and you will be victorious but the germans have a nasty supprise for you: 3 88s on the square in front of the reichstag. you mst destroy them before the time is up, or all your tanks are destroyed, after the destruction of the 88s you must get a squad of infantry into the reichstag. then the germans are defeated and you will become a hero of the soviet union.

+1 Very good suggestion, Kamerad. Btw, welcome to EF forum! ;)

Last edited August 15, 2010 at 5:39 PM by Werwolf

Level 3

Lol thats a big promation.

Indeed it is, mayby its too big.
How about commander of the Stalingrad front?

i hope that this will get into campaign
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Dukla_Pass
it was bloody battle, many Slovak partisans fight there...

Theres a big gap between Stalingrad and Seelow line, mabey 2 more missions?