Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

January 31, 2010 at 9:36 PM

Capt. wrote:
Bauer wrote:
Let no one compares the Panthers to T34/85. Panthers were better.

Panthers were - PzIV`s were not.

Are comparable. I know a game in which children should play. Combat Mission 2.There, no one cried that there is no balance.

Propably the next game of relic will be pong, but i'm not sure if they would be able to balance the sides.

Last edited January 31, 2010 at 9:38 PM by Bauer

#25347

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

January 31, 2010 at 9:43 PM

Ok, we have had our fun with the whole historical non patch related chat, but this is a balance thread.
So either keep game balance discussion or post in the appropriate section for that stuff.

Cheers

R.I.P MrScruff - A genuine Good Guy and great artist
R.I.P Loran Korn - A very brave and talented guy
RAP NEWS http://thejuicemedia.com/?ref=nf

#25354

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

January 31, 2010 at 9:52 PM

This is a discussion on the balance. Balance is not just whether the game is balanced but also how it is balanced. You can give Russia T-34 to destroy the tiger or PZ II to destroy the IS-2. But it would a bad balance for this game.

I think I was clear enough. Historical arguments do not affect balance. Keep it like that or use the 'Other discussions' thread for this kind of discussions

Propably the next game of relic will be pong, but i'm not sure if they would be able to balance the sides.

Last edited January 31, 2010 at 10:01 PM by Zerstörer

#25356

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

January 31, 2010 at 10:01 PM

I think he is trying to say that historical considerations should enter into balance, with an example that you could have a T34 be able to kill a tiger and have it balanced within the game, but it wouldn't make any sense.

#25359

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

January 31, 2010 at 10:07 PM

xenotype wrote:
I think he is trying to say that historical considerations should enter into balance, with an example that you could have a T34 be able to kill a tiger and have it balanced within the game, but it wouldn't make any sense.

Thx I from poland and i dont speak english soo good.

Propably the next game of relic will be pong, but i'm not sure if they would be able to balance the sides.

#25398

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 1, 2010 at 1:34 AM

Bauer wrote:
Zerstörer wrote:
Part of this is because not all the changes were implemented....its hardly the last patch...we're releasing the proper one later today so you need to get alot more games on that one

Then we back to russians OP

Perhaps the soviets are not OP and it is just you that is using the wrong tactics. You sound like a wehermacht/PE fanboy that wants he's tanks to be the strongest. First look at both parts of the story and then suggest something. I mean its nearly balanced there are still some small issues. but it is going in the right direction.

The only thing I hope for is that the problem with the recrewing will be solved so that the soviets can recrew their weapons.

#25431

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 1, 2010 at 8:01 AM

I agree with Capt.

Now the USSR can't even take half the map. Too weak.

Complete and utter waste of my time.

All this nerfing doesn't compensate for the lack of securing and re-crewing.

Those are big disadvantages.

And now they want to go off and make the Istheer, which will even be a stronger faction.

Last edited February 1, 2010 at 10:17 AM by Razz

#25540

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 1, 2010 at 4:49 PM

Between two good players the balance is just fine...they have this almost perfect, just a few more things (I play both sides but I have been trying to win as Wehr lately with 1.03 its 1:1 right now)

#25558

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 1, 2010 at 5:58 PM

QuoteAnd now they want to go off and make the Istheer, which will even be a stronger faction.

And where are you getting this information? Oh yeah, just assumptions. Stop trying to make your opinions into facts.

#25563

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 1, 2010 at 6:32 PM

You were quite happy to play 1.00 of utter OPness without complaint but as soon as we get the nerf bat out everyone starts crying cause they can't wipe the floor with an opponent...typical...

On another note...yes Soviets are be a bit UP at the moment but this IS a consious decision I've taken. This is because its easier to have a faction that is UP slowly turned into a better balanced faction rather than an OP one slowly turning into a balanced one, hence the hard initial nerfings!

No one really wants to play vs a blatantly OP faction, however, like PE at the moment alot of people will play with and against them. (unlike say brits and the roo spam)

Rather than the OP rubbish remarks, you guys should add valid feedback based on games/replays that will really help us balance the faction better.

'Waste of my time!', 'I'm uninstalling the mod because of the patch' blah blah blah and the like, neither help nor are they taken seriously in any way shape or form.

R.I.P MrScruff - A genuine Good Guy and great artist
R.I.P Loran Korn - A very brave and talented guy
RAP NEWS http://thejuicemedia.com/?ref=nf

#25575

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 1, 2010 at 7:16 PM

Nice summary.
Ok, then I'll question right to the point.
Is it possible to make soviet AT and mortar re-capturing?
I think that it is normal, in addition all other factions can do so.
It is no sence when, soldiers can't capture their own guns!!

What about that?

Best regards to moders.

#25611

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 1, 2010 at 9:01 PM

nope they cant. else COH will crash permanently.

does put ruskies at a massive massive disadvantage though.

relic needs to fix this issue.

#25621

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 1, 2010 at 9:14 PM

Yeah, re-crewing would definitely be in if it worked... seems retarded to take it out, but it crashes the game hard.

When and if we fix it, it'll be re-implemented... but that could be some time since we need support from Relic.

Smells like. Victory.

#25622

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 1, 2010 at 9:15 PM

Oh!
It is some kind of unfixable bag. I see.....

#25655

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 1, 2010 at 11:24 PM

For one I'm liking 1.3/4 a lot.
Coming very close to a nice balance now I think.

Just a few issues left and some tweaking of info and artwork and I'd be very happy :)

In Soviet Union, FAQ reads you!

#25657

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 1, 2010 at 11:29 PM

i'm sure if enough pressure is put on relic to fix the recrew crash issue they will do something about it. it's because of this mod they experienced record numbers of players. well, that and the steam sale, which had impecable timing if you ask me.. ;)

#25683

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 1:30 AM

Zerstörer wrote:
You were quite happy to play 1.00 of utter OPness without complaint but as soon as we get the nerf bat out everyone starts crying cause they can't wipe the floor with an opponent...typical...

On another note...yes Soviets are be a bit UP at the moment but this IS a consious decision I've taken. This is because its easier to have a faction that is UP slowly turned into a better balanced faction rather than an OP one slowly turning into a balanced one, hence the hard initial nerfings!

Great!

And I would not uninstall the mod.
I think your strategy for tweaking is what I would do.

It's just really hard right now for you guys to get both sides from spamming infantry. And it's hard to work around the No secure, no retreat, and no re-crew.

I just wish that German Pak wasn't bugged by Relic.
I'm still gonna play a few more games to see if I can think of anything.

The upgrades on the Soviets are good, it was the nerfing of other areas that I have to deal with for now to see if I can input any advice.

All I can really say is ones experience on different maps are completely different.

For example; you can struggle now on the new patch with EF maps, then go play a well know map from CoH and get some wild results depending upon, size, terrain and especially resources. This is the same map design problems in regular CoH where maps were laid out before the OF and TOV units came along.

I have designed maps and balanced units on other games.

It is very hard to tweak a balance.

You are doing the correct thing. Baby steps. Play, tweak, play tweak, play.

Oh, by the way ... I still get a freeze from the midi sounds. Doesn't always happen and never occurs in regular CoH. I have the latest drivers. Everything is fine. I haven't seen any other mention of crash or freezes coming from anyone else.

However there was discussion concerning sound. I posted it in the bug forum.

By they way... we had problem with re-crewing in the past. I believe it was in Sudden Strike. The problem was resolved. I went to the old archives and searched but couldn't find anything. I wish I could find those thread concerning that problem.

Last edited February 2, 2010 at 1:42 AM by Razz

#25725

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 5:28 AM

I have to say that so far 1.04 seems damn near close to perfectly balanced. My complaint with the /76 was answered with a reduction in cost and pop, making it cheap enough to warrant bringing out. Only issues with the mod remaining are the increased MP cost of mortars to 437 after upgrading, the highly linear state of soviet teching, the limit on Paras/Rangers, and some minor artwork that needs to be in. Thanks devs for a very reasonable and successful effort on balance!

edit: MG Dugout could use a reduction in price, because it can't be recrewed its a little unfair to have it be the most expensive MG in the game

Last edited February 2, 2010 at 7:46 AM by xenotype

#25744

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 5:59 AM

This would fix the teching problem 100%
http://easternfront.org/forums/index.php?topic=2436.0

#25758

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 8:28 AM

BurroDiablo wrote:
Yeah, re-crewing would definitely be in if it worked... seems retarded to take it out, but it crashes the game hard.

When and if we fix it, it'll be re-implemented... but that could be some time since we need support from Relic.

When it is repaired now it will not stop the Russians and they overgrown mortars. With this amount of Russian infantry nothing will stop the mortars in the early and mid-game

Propably the next game of relic will be pong, but i'm not sure if they would be able to balance the sides.

#25791

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 11:02 AM

Hey Bauer!!
I simply can't understand what are you claiming for?
Don't you even read content?
Even the developer says that they definely fix that bug if COH would be more cooperative.
And all your messages are similar to " if you do that or so soviets will be OP" Oh, wright, they are still OP and will be overpowered with any changes.

Com on man! Stop it. If you want to post, please read some previous posts though developers or testers.

#25793

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 11:10 AM

Bauer wrote:
BurroDiablo wrote:
Yeah, re-crewing would definitely be in if it worked... seems retarded to take it out, but it crashes the game hard.

When and if we fix it, it'll be re-implemented... but that could be some time since we need support from Relic.

When it is repaired now it will not stop the Russians and they overgrown mortars. With this amount of Russian infantry nothing will stop the mortars in the early and mid-game

Do you ever stop complaining? You won't be happy until you can beat back the Russians with nothing more than a Luger that fires farts.
IF it gets fixed, crews will be moved back down to normal 3 man teams. They can't retreat, they don't have MG's to cover them... just flank them, it's not hard. And after you've killed them, steal the mortar and use it yourself.

I put forward an idea of taking away the Soviet Howitzer and replacing it with a buildable Mortar pit like what the Brits have, but I'm not sure how well this would go down... the mortar would be immobile, but still just as deadly... then we can replace the gap in the Support Barracks with something else unbelievably OP'd like a DShK HMG or a Tyrannosaurus.

Smells like. Victory.

Last edited February 2, 2010 at 11:17 AM by BurroDiablo

#25796

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 11:21 AM

Do you ever stop complaining? You won't be happy until you can beat back the Russians with nothing more than a Luger that fires farts.
IF it gets fixed, crews will be moved back down to normal 3 man teams. They can't retreat, they don't have MG's to cover them... just flank them, it's not hard. And after you've killed them, steal the mortar and use it yourself.

I put forward an idea of taking away the Soviet Howitzer and replacing it with a buildable Mortar pit like what the Brits have, but I'm not sure how well this would go down... the mortar would be immobile, but still just as deadly... then we can replace the gap in the Support Barracks with something else unbelievably OP'd like a DShK HMG or a Tyrannosaurus.

IT IS VERY CORRECT!!!!
And for those who are not tired to complain - READ THIS MINIMUM TWICE!!

Best regards to modders.

Last edited February 2, 2010 at 11:24 AM by Zebra

#25802

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 12:26 PM

Perhaps this is so that he wants to Russians were very weak. But it is not. The point is that the Russians have a very early gun, capable of mass killing of all infantry units. No other army has no such thing. Germany have MG but Russians can just run past. Buildings do not provide protection, because the Russians could easily destroy them using a command of artillery and heavy mortars. Someone once tried to kill the initial phase of the command squad? The Russians did not even have to go back to the base, they are building to complement the infantry. soon have tanks that are not actually weak. Their snipers shoot from high speed and can call artillery. In the late stage may be anything more, we can have 1 tiger, they can have mass IS-2. PopCap infantry engaged. What can the WH and PE against IS-2 spam? They say that every paks and panther spam, but they have AT guns too. Overall, this is tralala.
Sorry for my opinio but Im only average player stats 1000/800 from normal COH.
I regret only that I can not talk to you in my language it would be easier and I can not look to it in such a way that he wants to destroy the Russians in this mod.

Thanks that he had done it because I waited for it for years. Do not expect easy victories but only balanced fight to end.

Propably the next game of relic will be pong, but i'm not sure if they would be able to balance the sides.

#25823

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 3:09 PM

Cry some more will you, and stop whining. Like stated a million times before you can flank the mortars easily!
I don't what you are thinking when you see those red flares. But most people run away the arty has a cooldown. you overrun,sniper or flank the mortars. And you can also do a 2 direction attack ever thought of that?

The soviets are no OP stop whining. if you want your axis forces the be invincible go download the invincible axis mod and take your whining with you.

And I wanted to ask the developers if they could tell me if they have any plans about remodeling some soviets units?
For example the Russian AT gun. If yes could they please tell me which units they want to remodel in the near future?

#25826

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 3:23 PM

We have a DShK tripod model ready but it needs animated, we'll probably put it in the HMG Nests. We also have a ZiS-2 model, but this also need animated (and a new skin I think), an M-30 model (needs skinned and animated) and we're working on some kind of way to incorporate an M1938 model into the game successfully.

Smells like. Victory.

#25845

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 4:58 PM

Bauer, I'm going to make this quite simple for you cause all I've ever seen you post is OP noobish unfounded, bad theorycraft complaint clearly coming from an Axis fanboy without a real sense of good balance...no doubt you think the Pak works fine right now too...

These kind of ''opinions'' are not and will not ever be taken into account cause they're rubbish, simple as that, end of story.

R.I.P MrScruff - A genuine Good Guy and great artist
R.I.P Loran Korn - A very brave and talented guy
RAP NEWS http://thejuicemedia.com/?ref=nf

Last edited February 2, 2010 at 5:01 PM by Zerstörer

#25850

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 5:25 PM

Axis fanboy

British and Americans also played a lot of times and did not tell me I'm the fan boy. But it seems you are your own army fan boys. And you take into account only the opinion of people adore your new army.

Propably the next game of relic will be pong, but i'm not sure if they would be able to balance the sides.

#25854

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 5:41 PM

you can't call them fan boys because they are trying to balance their new faction to that so people of any army combination can win with the right amount of skill... I have played both sides of the mod USSR and Axis and BOTH are almost completely equal right now

#25862

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 6:22 PM

QuoteAnd you take into account only the opinion of people adore your new army.

Quite contradictory to the fact we've been nerfing everything since the beginning.

Smells like. Victory.

#25882

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 7:59 PM

Bauer wrote:
Perhaps this is so that he wants to Russians were very weak. But it is not. The point is that the Russians have a very early gun, capable of mass killing of all infantry units. No other army has no such thing.

Stuh vs russian blob COH:EF

R.I.P MrScruff - A genuine Good Guy and great artist
R.I.P Loran Korn - A very brave and talented guy
RAP NEWS http://thejuicemedia.com/?ref=nf

Last edited February 2, 2010 at 9:32 PM by BurroDiablo

#25883

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 8:23 PM

Blitz is my favorite Wehr vs Soviets JUST for the StuH... I had a single StuH shot kill 25 USSR troops in one god :D it was a small victory in that very long battle

#25894

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 9:02 PM

Has there been any discussion of raising tank hunters MP cost to 270-300 and make them more survivable?

Currently, they are the only allied Hand-held at that doesnt chase off an armored car or a puma.

Also, what was behind the discession of moving mines to Tank Hunters? Currently, Soviets have no soft counter for any vechile in until the support center comes.

#25896

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 9:16 PM

BurroDiablo wrote:
QuoteAnd you take into account only the opinion of people adore your new army.

Quite contradictory to the fact we've been nerfing everything since the beginning.

I know

This video proves nothing. How many Russians have to kill to have 5 points of command? StuH to buy? Mortar will get faster.

But the end does not want to argue more. I believe that everything you do will be good. And yes I know you tries more than Relic. (Remember how they released WH2). And so I played because you (EF grup) done a good job. Finally, I have to adjust. The final version of the whole mod far, the ostherr will probably work just as much as the Russians.

I promise that I will not be more sentences uttered on Russian forces.

Propably the next game of relic will be pong, but i'm not sure if they would be able to balance the sides.

#25898

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 9:33 PM

Zerstörer wrote:
Bauer wrote:
Perhaps this is so that he wants to Russians were very weak. But it is not. The point is that the Russians have a very early gun, capable of mass killing of all infantry units. No other army has no such thing.

Stuh vs russian blob COH:EF

Thats some crazy carnage. Sometimes makes me wish we could have bodies stay on the field...

Smells like. Victory.

#25902

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 9:45 PM

Other mods have that...

Why this mod don't ..?..

http://www.worldwar2.ro/

#25903

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 9:48 PM

It's not vanilla and lags games. Also, I think we need to get the wounded infantry off the field asap to minimise the amount of casualties being picked up by Allied Medic tents.

Smells like. Victory.

#25904

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 2, 2010 at 10:05 PM

4 Medic tents all near each other in 1.00 would produce at least 6 squads in the first 10 minutes of game :/

#25958

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 3, 2010 at 3:22 AM

I fell really sorry for the developers right now, having to put up with this when THEY MADE THE GAME. If you don't like their balance, don't use the game THAT THEY SPENT THE TIME MAKING SO YOU PEOPLE COULD DOWNLOAD IT FOR FREE.
(sorry about the other post, posted it before i realized the above.)

#25967

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 3, 2010 at 4:12 AM

your angry :o

#26394

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 4, 2010 at 10:58 PM

No, its just that people pay attention if you use caps : )

#26396

Re: Patch 1.03 WHAT HAVE YOU DONE...

February 4, 2010 at 10:59 PM

no we don't... or at least I don't... I see caps and think.. he's angry and I ain't reading his post :-/