The Propaganda Ministry Calls for Replays

After reading all the comments and rethinking my statments i think the IS3 removal will fix some issues.

Its correct that IS2 as the best AT/AI tank will be the most attractive one in the tank hall. As a breakthrough tank it has the best armour, one of the strongest guns and a big aoe. If there wouldn´t be a ressource limitation this is the tank to go for. It counters everything up to Panther/Tiger easily and has a big splash against infantry.
The reason why T34 are build too is that you need earlier tanks and dont have the ressources. If you have already T34 buying the 85mm upgrade is the next logical step if you have researched only 1 pool in tier2 and the heavy tankovy ressource wise.
Still the IS2 should stay because you have not always the ressources to get it and if Tiger/IS fights are very entertaining. The focus is not on the T34 anymore however which was the most produced tank in the war.
If we delete the IS2 from the tank hall it would look then like a USA clone (sherman + upgun)

The real problem is the IS3. You get for 500MP a IS2 on steroids to your already existing IS2 army. That makes RHS BT always more attractive than the LHS with IL2. Even if we would nerf the IS3, the fact that it can fight alone (battletank) makes it still more favourable.
What would be left is the ISU152. It is supposed to be a support vehicles which helps in tank battle but not leads them. Imo a much better synergy with the tanks in the tankhall and much more interesting to play than spamming IS tanks.
Also the LHS BT would be more attractive too and a solid choice to go for. (especially with the recent changes made)

What are your thoughts?

Last edited August 2, 2012 at 10:53 AM by Killar

SublimeSimuz wrote:
Basically, I believe there are three ways to deal with the IS2:
One is to always have a PE on the team, preferrably tank hunter.
Another is to buff some wehrmacht units' armor penetration against the IS2, like the panther.
The third is to set some kind of limit to how many IS2s can be built. Maybe 3, maybe 2, or perhaps make the soviet player have to get some kind of upgrade to exceed the unit limit.

Well, I'd like to note that the IS 2 is still less cost efficient as Panthers since it's more expensive and has a lower rate of fire. I don't even think it's "efficient" against infantry. Sure, it has splash and can kill more than one soldier at a time, but since it shoots so slowly and has pretty poor accuracy in general I find using it against infantry is quite pointless.

Also you can kill an IS 2 with Panzer IVs, it's just that it's easier to do with a Panther instead.

T34 or KV tanks have much better performance against infantry and are way cheaper. Imo its not really needed to hardcap it.
I agree with Killar that the IS-3 is the main problem.

Last edited August 2, 2012 at 1:43 PM by dArCReAvEr

Killar wrote:
After reading all the comments and rethinking my statments i think the IS3 removal will fix some issues.

Its correct that IS2 as the best AT/AI tank will be the most attractive one in the tank hall. As a breakthrough tank it has the best armour, one of the strongest guns and a big aoe. If there wouldn´t be a ressource limitation this is the tank to go for. It counters everything up to Panther/Tiger easily and has a big splash against infantry.
The reason why T34 are build too is that you need earlier tanks and dont have the ressources. If you have already T34 buying the 85mm upgrade is the next logical step if you have researched only 1 pool in tier2 and the heavy tankovy ressource wise.
Still the IS2 should stay because you have not always the ressources to get it and if Tiger/IS fights are very entertaining. The focus is not on the T34 anymore however which was the most produced tank in the war.
If we delete the IS2 from the tank hall it would look then like a USA clone (sherman + upgun)

The real problem is the IS3. You get for 500MP a IS2 on steroids to your already existing IS2 army. That makes RHS BT always more attractive than the LHS with IL2. Even if we would nerf the IS3, the fact that it can fight alone (battletank) makes it still more favourable.
What would be left is the ISU152. It is supposed to be a support vehicles which helps in tank battle but not leads them. Imo a much better synergy with the tanks in the tankhall and much more interesting to play than spamming IS tanks.
Also the LHS BT would be more attractive too and a solid choice to go for. (especially with the recent changes made)

What are your thoughts?

As I said a good reward unit for the ISU152 would be the Su100, if u want one
An Is3 or Is2Ace is/would be just OP
I think a hradcap for Is2 would be great as well

Another Point is that the building time for the Su Snipers is way to short, they are just to spamabel

IS-2 is really fine where it is.

IS-3 is the problem, but ofc its getting the nerf bat.  At the moment its totally not cost-effective to fight the IS-3 with PG shrecks.  Get a shot in with a shreck, and you may or may not penetrate the IS-3.  If the shreck does penetrate, it takes off minimal health.  Your PGs, which are 45 reenforce per man however, will probably get shredded by the IS-3 gun...  I wouldn't object either if it got removed totally; but I wouldn't have a problem with a simple nerf first either.

Soviet sniper spam in team games IS really a problem.  3 snipers so early in the game versus PGs is really a problem.  It really FORCES PE to go Scout Car spam as the only viable option.  But there's also a problem if we don't allow support weapons early on either, because both Soviet players going conscripts is too weak, and cannot compare to USA riflespam for example.  Even in 1v1 versus Wehrmacht, the Wehr sniper is at a critical disadvantage due to the sheer amount of squad members Soviets tend to have per squad.  Shoot a Strelky, and its only 19 reenforce gone max, and 1/6 guys down.  Shoot a Gren, and its 37 manpower, 1/4 guys down.  Its the same with USA, but the USA sniper has a slower reload than the Wehr sniper.  Soviet sniper currently has the same reload rate as the USA, but I think it should be tone down a bit more to compensate for their even more numerous and cheap men.

Last edited August 3, 2012 at 3:52 PM by Yauz

e-gon wrote:
Another Point is that the building time for the Su Snipers is way to short, they are just to spamabel

Already changed ;)

Well the reason i keep going on about the IS-2 is while all you say might be true. People still go for it right away.

perhaps the Solution might be to replace it with the KV ? Still a heavier tank, but not IS-2 class. then move the IS-2 to the IS-3 spot and give it a small buff ?

I mean the issue in general seems to be that a lot of units just end up collecting dust while the IS-2s and 3s get all the fun.

Yauz wrote:
IS-2 is really fine where it is.
  Shoot a Strelky, and its only 19 reenforce gone max, and 1/6 guys down. 

fix'd

Well another sunday, and another Episode

http://youtu.be/N8Pazk-5fuA

Was a bit of a tough one >.>

Quote"... make a decision with the capital letters..."

lol ;D

Watching it atm.

EDIT:
Btw, your comments about the barbed wire thingy made my day ;D.

2nd. EDIT:
I think I'll change "The Armoury" to just "Armoury" so you can at least not worry about it ;D.

Last edited August 5, 2012 at 11:48 PM by blackbishop

I remember feeling some of building names were either bad or superfluous when they were implemented... guess I just got used to them :P

The fast forwarding makes it look like you don´t like casting the game. Plp watching your cast dont want to continue either then.

Also you switch fast over the map. Its hard keep tracking whats going on.

Otherwise good cast!

Sadly we have not many quality replays to offer. Automatch conditions on high level is rarely played or just not posted.

We need a 1vs1 tourney

Last edited August 6, 2012 at 2:59 PM by Killar

It's not really useful to bitch about gameplay when this was a complete for fun game. Glimz and I were on mumble while playing. We were like "oh well, let's just play some random stuff and see how it goes." RHS urban heavy mortar rbs spam vs wirespam :D

However, the t34-85 usage was really awful, I didn't notice I wasted so many without accomplishing anything when I played^^
Nice cast though and gg.

Last edited August 6, 2012 at 4:41 PM by dArCReAvEr

I know i can switch around a bit. As for the fast forwarding. Well sometimes things just get very quiet with nothing happening.. Speeding up helps, it's something i do in particular with a longer game :) Just there to actually ensure people don't fall asleep or leave :p

@darcreaver: Easy for you to say that now isn't it ? :P All i had was that, i mean it was still more interesting than some of the other stuff i had.. but bloody hell... >.>

Anyways, glad you all enjoyed.

How do you get these games? :P Glimz didn't give for sure, Darc? There are more action, back and forth games int he replay section or in the tourney. I wonder what you have in your portfolio atm. I can send you some replays 1v1 or 2v2's but I dunno which types of games you like cause Axis victories not interesting for you.

Riggsman wrote:
How do you get these games? :P Glimz didn't give for sure, Darc? There are more action, back and forth games int he replay section or in the tourney. I wonder what you have in your portfolio atm. I can send you some replays 1v1 or 2v2's but I dunno which types of games you like cause Axis victories not interesting for you.

Me neither.

Well all interesting games are interesting, The trouble is.. Variety. I can't just show German victories :p despite how lovely that would be, it would also be a bit boring for my viewers i suspect :)

Hmm... Rather then which faction wins, the game itself is not important? Did you get such feed back like "no more Axis wins"?

I get it from my regular episodes. People do want some variety, otherwise it also becomes.. Predictable. And people also want it to be a bit unpredictable. After 500 episodes you do get a bit of experience with this. But only a bit :) And initially, i just wanted something with the soviets winning initially as well.

Well another Episode is up.
http://youtu.be/TxTcqwcD5zQ

Hope you enjoy :)

Tank hunters, mortars and AT guns get an extra crew member at vet2. Drauf had 7 gren squads come out of that bunker throughout the game.

Last edited August 12, 2012 at 2:49 AM by GodlikeDennis

I'd love to play a few games, hopefully I can get a decent replay and Dane will have something worthwhile to cast. Unfortunately nobody ever seems to be online, and when they are it's only ever skirmishes or comp stomps. How boredom.

Last edited August 13, 2012 at 9:27 AM by IchbinKrieg

IchbinKrieg wrote:
Unfortunately nobody ever seems to be online

THats why you should get on the forums and arrange a game :P. Either that or join the tournament.

Quote
I'd love to play a few games, hopefully I can get a decent replay and Dane will have something worthwhile to cast. Unfortunately nobody ever seems to be online, and when they are it's only ever skirmishes or comp stomps. How boredom.

Check this list for names/factions people play:
http://www.easternfront.org/forums/index.php?topic=3419.0

Just post here if you are online and I'm sure somebody will come online then:
http://www.easternfront.org/forums/index.php?topic=4772.255

Sorry for the Off Topic.

Another week, another Episode. A short 2v2 featuring me :P and a few other people >.> Not that they matter :P *coughs*
http://youtu.be/Y-kxB-DcUKM

The AI can choose a new doctrine when it takes over. I think this bug was fixed by the AI coders for the next patch. You'll have to ask jojo or Otto.

GodlikeDennis wrote:
The AI can choose a new doctrine when it takes over.

Wow I never knew that. I guess it is possible to see vet3 stormtropers with inspired assault or FTFL :o

Or Rangers with Ze Pershing,or









IS-3 MARCHING THROUGH THE GOD OF WAR!!!!

No worries. Just bloody well confused me for a moment. Thought i'd gotten the hang of the doctrines and then that happened :P

*hides*

Rizz wrote:
*hides*

NKVD thinks you can do all the hiding you want down the salt mines :P

And another 2v2 is up. Hope you all enjoy :) Including Rizz :p

http://youtu.be/BMXKHKc7I5s

Was wondering if you could turn off 'Object Scarring' in your options to stop Soviet tanks having those ugly black flickering artifacts appear after they've been hit. It's not game breaking, just personal preference, from an aesthetic point of view it does make my stomach turn whenever I see them :P Great cast still ;D

@dane

i just noticed that you was wondering in the most replays that the players havent choose a commander even if the game reached already the midgame

the reason is pretty simple
in ef its much more important to react with your doctrin to the choosen doctrin of your enemy
so if you take too early your doctrin is mostly not that good

but dont get me wrong
it can work but you lost your flexibility and can't react on the chosen one of your enemy

ApeMen wrote:
@dane

i just noticed that you was wondering in the most replays that the players havent choose a commander even if the game reached already the midgame

the reason is pretty simple
in ef its much more important to react with your doctrin to the choosen doctrin of your enemy
so if you take too early your doctrin is mostly not that good

but dont get me wrong
it can work but you lost your flexibility and can't react on the chosen one of your enemy

The Soviets are unique in that their doctrinal selection does not entirely decide their route of gameplay.

With the Americans and the Panzer Elite, their Doctrinal selection is most likely made early-mid game and is used to fill stop gaps within the faction and supplement the faction with bonuses that are invariably used in gameplay
Ex. Using American Rangers to prevent early Vehicles Rushes in conjunction with Riflemen and help combat Grenadiers that Rifles can struggle against.
Ex. Using PE Hetzers as a better AT stopgap until Panthers
However with the Wehrmacht and the British, the Doctrinal selection is probably made early and used to only add onto the strengths of your faction selection, or increase the strength of an existing strategy.
Ex. Even though the Wehrmacht has access to Veteran Panthers as AT and plenty of Anti Infantry, the KT seals the deal to any game without ATG Spam
Ex. The British can already use Howitzers by default, however going RCA just amplifies your artillery advantage by improving range and broadening options.

The Soviets are quite reflexive throughout the entire gameplay and doctrinal choice is usually geared to how your enemy is playing.

so long time and no new casts? :(

And there wont be.  :-\

oh why?
he stopped casting?

I think so

Yes, I saw him in a chat before 2-3 days and he told me there will be no more EF casts. The main reason is the lack of good reaplays.

mh i dont think that the reason is the lack of good games
its more that the good players dont allow him to cast their replays^^

Doesn't that amount to the same thing? Not having good stuff to cast

it depends^^
i think when dane would promise dont talk bad (or let good players look bad) in the casts they would allow him again to casts their games

just an example ashes is lvl 15 in ranked games but at lest i remember one game dane let him look like a noob :D
thats why ashes dont want that dane casts games with him

its not nice to let players look like a noob


sure you could say hey its just a game and i liked the casts of dane too but maybe he should think about this and then he might get new good replay to cast

Lvl16 Please, thx ;) No, he called me "one of the worse players in EF" ^^

Well I'm not upset of his departure as a caster because he doesn't respect the players and trying to praise himself and his so called "knowledge" in order to make it somehow "entertaining". We watched his game with Donthateme ( he's lvl 15 in 1v1) as a player which he didn't respect or support him in the game, after the game and during the cast. He is somehow preoccupied with an idea that "all those basterds are noobs, why I'm wasting my time peh". So he doesn't cast anymore and I'm happy actually. If he would respect the game/players and cast neutrally instead of being the star of the show I would be really upset because EF offers much more entertainment than the other Mods and awesome mod for casting.

I'm watching vidcastings since ages and never heard of him until he started to cast EF and saw that he already had more than 500 casts :D He is not in the same league with  AmiPolizei, Tommy, Krebs, Inverse, Vitensby, CallmeSarge or Yauz/GLD.

Finally, if we are desperate of castings that make people upset of Dane's absence then it's our guilt as a community that noone bothers to do castings and waiting Yauz to do it ( e-gon does as well but only in German :/ )

Anyway first I thought it would be great that he's casting and his work would promote EF more in GR community but his treatment was awful despite the comments in youtube that many people liked the game and the action. 

Last edited October 7, 2012 at 2:22 PM by Riggsman

It was fairly obvious that Dane didn't particularly like the mod, he must of complained about conscripts and the IS-3 nearly every game. His initial reason for casting EF games was due to public demand. But at least he gave it a go I suppose and tried the Mod out, if he didn't like it then oh well.

Although I do agree he did have a nasty habit of bashing the EF regulars, Glimz especially.

The irony of the situation is that if you go onto his channel and cycle through the vids you'll notice the EF games have considerably more views, even more so than the pro games.

JB23 wrote:
The irony of the situation is that if you go onto his channel and cycle through the vids you'll notice the EF games have considerably more views, even more so than the pro games.

That certainly is ironic isn't it  ;D?

Bread wrote:

JB23 wrote:
The irony of the situation is that if you go onto his channel and cycle through the vids you'll notice the EF games have considerably more views, even more so than the pro games.

That certainly is ironic isn't it  ;D?

nope. its BEAST!

Well the reason i stopped casting is rather manifold.

1) Lack of good (Read, entertaining replays, vital difference there)

2) Lack of time on my part due to university beginning again and the simple fact that i couldn't be arsed to do all that plus dig through a bunch of EF replays trying to look for something mildly entertaining.

3) Lack of replays overall. Simple fact is. Barely any replays were produced or sent in. It made it bloody difficult for me to actually find anything. I mean the usual process of casting tends to involve a lot of replays getting discarded for various reasons. One primary one being repetition. And sadly, a lot of the replays that were there. Well largely did feature the exact same thing over and over again.

C'est la vie. But seeing how people are acting. Good thing i left :) Clearly a few people on their high horses need to get down and perhaps do a bit of critical self-reflection.

But you continue enjoying your mod :) In the end that is what matters. Not my thing though, and i believe i made it clear from the beginning ;)

Cheers.
Imperial Dane.

Imperial wrote:
C'est la vie. But seeing how people are acting. Good thing i left :) Clearly a few people on their high horses need to get down and perhaps do a bit of critical self-reflection.

Will you cast this game?

http://hq-coh.com/forum/index.php?topic=28054.0

Was not so entertaining though, but nice to watch

well, thank you for what you did do, although some of us here at EF may not appreciate your method, i think we can all agree that we appreciate your effort. I wish you good luck in your future casts, and hope that maybe you could arrange to cast some othseer matches once they are completed. until, then best of luck to you.