New Army

OK, this topic has been floating in and out of the form and I want to bring everyone's ideas right here,

Most of us here loved the Soviet Army and will download it as soon as it comes out, but as we talk about the 3rd German Army the "Ostheer" some people including myself didn’t quite like that idea, we already have 2 German armies, and the Germans had only so many vehicles and units, it seems you guys are redoing the Weher with some new units but relatively unchanged, so we continue debating about another army, but heres one that is not only possible, but is also historically accurate and no it’s not the Japanese, but still an Ally of the Germans, The Italian Army,

At first I and you probably you right now, was or are a little skeptical; they rarely did anything by themselves without the Germans beside, leading, and behind them. Their vehicles were most of the time inferior the Allies, as were their weapons, and tactics, also many people believed that they used all German equipment and had none of their own  least that’s what I’ve been taught. But after doing a little research I found out that they had a lot of unique units,

From their tanks,
http://www.geocities.com/pentagon/quarters/1975/g_tnkita.htm

To their uniforms they brought into battle. 
http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/7474/ita50gpxl4.jpg

Here's my ultimate source for this topic
http://www.comandosupremo.com/Smallarms.html

We're adding in the Ostheer, no questions asked. We are not adding in the Japanese, or the Italians, or the Romanians, or the Finns or any Aliens.
There are still a lot of German vehicles that aren't in this game and we plan to add some of them...

I like this idea! After the Red Army and Ostheer you should create Italy on Axis Side and I believe also creating a Balkan Army(mix of Yugoslavia and Greece) on Allies Side because they have a great part to this war.

I am talking about a second release of this mod later to have these two new armies...
Of course all these things are just my opinion.

Let them finish what they started, it takes a lot of time to make a Mod and they are trying to make this one the best of them all. Maybe in a few years you can complain about not having the Italians in COH.

Im sure theres an Italian Front mod in the works, plus theres an Africa Korps/Desert Rats one out now too  :)

Actually, you would find the Italians had one of the most Modern of armies at the time. There navy was very superior to anything the Allies had. However their crews lacked the morale to use them.

And the British Navy soon became the best in the world. In fact there was one report in the Mediterranean of a Italian fleet preparing to assault the British Med. Fleet, and as they came over the Horizon they saw the Royal Navy and retreated back to port.

Also the Italians invaded North Africa before Rommel arrived. If I recall correctly the Italians pushed the British back quite far, but then the British pushed them back, then Rommel arrived with the Afrika Korps and pushed the British back, then the British pushed the Afrika Korps back and launched Operation Avalanche with the Indians and the Americans.

Which is when the US Gen. Mark Clarke tried to take all the glory (as usual per the US) and advanced toward Rome whilst ignoring the retreating German/Italian armies. And thus the plan was disengaged and it was basically a disorganized advance on the side of the Americans and the British had to advance on their own original plan.

That is  funny .The germans had most elite army in world war 2 .British had most elite navy.The germans had best tanks:tiger,panzer III,Panzer IV,Jagdpanther  which is the best tank of the war my opinion only .The italians had the worst army .They surrenderd 1943 .Sorry for my english

Last edited September 21, 2009 at 2:25 PM by Leopard_st

Leopard_st is absolutely right- and the worst thing is: after they had surrendered to the allies they started to fight against the germans who helped them in greece and africa

They had surrender...sure, but what should they do when their land is occupied by Wehrmacht and western alliies?
And the problem of the italian army was the officercorps and the fact that were not prepared for war.

BUT i think that a new Ostheer would be the best solution for this mod because when you think about the eastern front your first thought is that the eastern front was the front where soviets and germans fight against each other. The invader with its blitzkrieg-warmachine against the defenders with their endless manpower and weapons.
When you made such a mod i think you have to present BOTH sides ;)

I vote for Italy, Hungary or Finland. I'm sick of Germans.
P.S. the Italian Social Republic survived until April 25, 1945

Last edited September 21, 2009 at 4:31 PM by UeArtemis

I am not fan of germany .I am just saying that italians were weak. Germany had discipline .That is the reason why italy surrendered  early in the war.And i vote for yugoslavia or finland.

Last edited September 21, 2009 at 4:43 PM by Leopard_st

You are assuming a lot of things about the Ostheer. Especially because there has no info been released to the public at all yet.

Just slightly altered Wehr with some few new units. Who do you think we are.

And about Italians. Gonna send you with M13/40s against T-34s and IS-2s. Right.

No, with P26/40, M15/42 and heavy doctrinal German vehicles ^_^

And, maybe, Semovente da 75/34, Semovente da 75/18 and Semovente Da 90/53 =)

Last edited September 21, 2009 at 5:17 PM by UeArtemis

That is right apex .Send Semovante M 149/40 to is-2 or jagdtiger or kingtiger or just tiger.And we will se result.

QuoteThey had surrender...sure, but what should they do when their land is occupied by Wehrmacht and western alliies?

easily waiting until the allies win the war

QuoteI am just saying that italians were weak. Germany had discipline

in africa the italians did a pretty good job when they were combined with german forces

and i am voting for the ostheer maybe with some doctrine units from hungaria, finnland or italy

Fieldmarshall Rommel said about the italian army that they had good soldiers but bad officers  ;)

For EF you cant implement the italians because after 1943 their were no more italians. But their is an other "important" fact...do you want to play a map called Berlin oder Königsberg with the italian army xD Sounds crazy  ;D

When you talk about axies then focus on a nation like hungaria. I think IF ( this is a HUGH IF i think ) EF Mod would implement axies-troups hungaria would be the best because they fight till the end and they had same interesting tanks, sturmgeschütze and other weapons.

But i say again that the Wehrmacht has so much more you can add in CoH like the Ferdiandt, the Brummbär, MG34, magnetic mines, StuKa and so on! You dont need a new nation. Look at all the ideas here in the forum. Enough space for a new german army!

Last edited September 21, 2009 at 8:54 PM by Lord Rommel

I tend to agree with most of what is being said about the Italian army not being suitable for a separate army in COH. Let’s face it, they lost to Greece fair and square and were pushed back by into Albania by forces significantly less equipped. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greco-Italian_War

The idea of an Ostheer army is really the only logical choice and I congratulate the developers on this choice. However I do share some of the questions being asked about them, as none of us want to see a re-badged wehrmacht. Provided they can make Ostheer significantly unique I think it could work nicely, perhaps it could include a mix of the eastern axis supporters in the doctrine trees. (Much like the British have Canadian influence in one of theirs). This may very well include some Italian units and hopefully German paratroopers that were used in Crete and mainland Greece.

Obviously the game is going to pit Ostheer against the US in somewhat historically inaccurate battles, but as someone said: ‘who cares?’ this is a game after all and keeping it dynamic/versatile will allow for lots of fun gaming. If some of the above advice regarding a dynamic Ostheer is taken into account the historical accuracy of things will become less of an issue. The US did after all fight the Germans in Italy and the British fought them in Greece.

Last edited September 22, 2009 at 2:08 AM by ForceMultiplier

Lord Rommel is correct .It would really pathetic to play Berlin map with Italians

Last edited September 22, 2009 at 1:50 PM by Leopard_st

is there a squad that just has ppsh-41s and is there tank traps

Ingenery have just SMGs. In large groups with the Sturmovie Ingenery upgrade, they are indominitable.