Strategy & Tactics

Well guys,

i guess everybody here enjoys some warfare from time to time... but i was wondering: what kind of strategy & tactics do you favor? what would your ideal operation, be it defensive or offensive, look like?

for example: although i favor a swift campaign in which the enemy's forces are encircled using Blitzkrieg tactics, but on the other hand I'd like a good fight as well.

share some opinions with me guys, and your views on strategy & tactics, please ;).

Last edited July 12, 2011 at 2:07 PM by loatty

I'm typical turtle. I won't get in serious fighting unless I have something to own easilly. Like ISU or Tiger tanks. And I love full scale massive attacks with arty barrages and other stuff. They mostly aren't successful, but I'm not this kind of player who makes rage-quit when he loses his favourite unit.
Small, focused operations fit me well. That's why in HoI3 when playing Soviet Union I'm defending in years 1941-1944, and then steamroll Axis straight to Berlin.

My favorite strategy is to let the stupid politicians fight for their own stupid ideologies. ;D

I love using fire superiority and flanking the enemy. When there is a draw between both sides in let's say the middle of the map, I rather wait to build up an army which is superior to the one of my enemie(s) and then I start a huge flanking maneuver to surprise them!
I can't stand if I lose whole squads or have heavy losses driving a frontal major offensive, I'd rather get some indirect fire weapons and siege them until I have enough firepower for a succesful flanking.

lol, me and Maxi would create perfect war machine  :P

i try to build up my forces while holding on to a predetermined area of control which i then use to launch strong attacks, designed to wear down the enemy's forces.

Note: sadly, i never really complete the part of preparing my forces, because i usually seem to wait around to often, building defenses in case my offense fails.

One of the Tactics I always try to implement is to secure a minimum acceptable base resource income. As I gain or lose map control I am at least able to pursue a consistent Teching Stategy. As far as Grand Tactical goes I use TaskForce/KampfGruppe oriented operations. I always employ some sort of Strategic Reserve. Be it severely damaged/decimated units, Units unsuitable for use in my current Operation(s- ::) ),or a significant resource pool. Strategically I believe diversions, recon and change of line of operations are most effective tactics.

My favourite statregy is sell weapons for both sides while enjoy they killing each other for their stupid ideologies and goverment's lies.

Combined armed tactics FTW!

steamroller mass attack

soviet war machine ftw 8)

Combined arms all the time, every time.

Wehr: Heavy tanks supported by mass infantry.

PE: Infantry HT rush with G43 / Shrecked PGs.

USA: Snipers, riflemen, AT guns, with P47 strafing runs on horn.

Brit: Gayness.

Yauz wrote:
Brit: Gayness.

+1  ;D

Yauz wrote:
Brit: Gayness.

What have you against the Brits, man? ::)

Nothing against the Brits in general, but the way Relic implemented them in COH..
Lame camper faction. Could have been much more interesting.  ;)

But we're talking about real life here, not a video game. ;)

Yauz wrote:
Combined arms all the time, every time.

Wehr: Heavy tanks supported by mass infantry.

PE: Infantry HT rush with G43 / Shrecked PGs.

USA: Snipers, riflemen, AT guns, with P47 strafing runs on horn.

Brit: Gayness.

Yauz clearly refered to COH here.  ;)

Perhaps, but this is supposed to be about real life, so i just assumed... :(

I also misunderstood.  My Stategic principals come from SunTzu, Musashi, Machiavelli and Basil Liddell Hart. If I were engaged in warefare I am partial to the policies of Tamerlane, WT Sherman and NB Forrest.

pariah wrote:
Perhaps, but this is supposed to be about real life, so i just assumed... :(

Hmmm...if its real life war strategy then it'd be simple.  Provided the home populace aren't squeemish about extended war or about things like bombing innocent civilians too, I'd say whoever holds the superior air power holds the war.

Indeed, not taking a potentially difficult home front into account, and considering that the objective is to defeat the enemy (without needing to occupy their territory) then by all means: bomb the living daylight out of them. If you do want to occupy them: bomb the living daylight out of any militairy equipment and then send in a few tank brigades and a few specialised infantry battalions (special being: marines, airborne, commando's etc.)

Why not just use nukes? :P

pariah wrote:
Why not just use nukes? :P

Because for some stupid reason you can get away with bombing the shit out of them, but you can't get away with nukes.  It would still look bad internationally if you bomb them back to the stone age, but no one would actually intervene.  Nukes on the other hand...are another story.

pariah wrote:
Why not just use nukes? :P

Well, apart from what Yauz said: chances are high that the other side will throw some nukes back.

If you are losing to the point your cities are being bombed, wouldn't you launch the nukes, anyway? :P

pariah wrote:
If you are losing to the point your cities are being bombed, wouldn't you launch the nukes, anyway? :P

No, cities being bombed does not per definition mean that you are losing. Also, if you don't nuke them (which also means they won't nuke you), then you are able to start a resistance/guerilla war, something which is rather impossible when your country is a giant nuclear wasteland.

pariah wrote:
If you are losing to the point your cities are being bombed, wouldn't you launch the nukes, anyway? :P

Usually the country being bombed back to the stone age doesn't have nuclear weapons.  Its usually the guy who's doing the bombing that has a big stick.  If you have nuclear weapons I doubt anyone would have the balls to try and bomb you in the first place.

are we on about ingame or real life?

ingame - mortars
real life - SAS style raids coupled with air superiority

This is the history section, so real life. ;) World war 2 era, too. ;)

and when i ask everyone here to come up with plans for breaking a stalemate or crush enemy defences?

to start with something:
you have 10 divisions (7 infantry, 2 armoured and 1 elite armoured for a grand total of 180.000 men and 900 tanks, 350 of which are slightly aged)
facing you are 22 enemy divisions (a total of 350.000 men and 2000 tanks).

intelligence suggest they consist of 15 infantry, 5 armoured and 2 mechanized infantry divisions, of which 1 armoured and both mechanized infantry divisions are kept in reserve behind the lines.

lets say the front line is quite like a straight line, with one minor bulge (about 50 km deep), both under your control, on either end.

the enemy does not have superiority in the air, but has a powerfull AA defence readied and waiting.

you are given the command over a airfleet of 500 planes, of which 150 bombers, 300 fighters and 50 divebombers.



suprise me with some good tactics, guys, I'm wondering what you could make of this! :D

Nukes! ;D

loatty wrote:
and when i ask everyone here to come up with plans for breaking a stalemate or crush enemy defences?

to start with something:
you have 10 divisions (7 infantry, 2 armoured and 1 elite armoured for a grand total of 180.000 men and 900 tanks, 350 of which are slightly aged)
facing you are 22 enemy divisions (a total of 350.000 men and 2000 tanks).

intelligence suggest they consist of 15 infantry, 5 armoured and 2 mechanized infantry divisions, of which 1 armoured and both mechanized infantry divisions are kept in reserve behind the lines.

lets say the front line is quite like a straight line, with one minor bulge (about 50 km deep), both under your control, on either end.

the enemy does not have superiority in the air, but has a powerfull AA defence readied and waiting.

you are given the command over a airfleet of 500 planes, of which 150 bombers, 300 fighters and 50 divebombers.



suprise me with some good tactics, guys, I'm wondering what you could make of this! :D

What about artillery support?

....

Anyway with tactics. It would be partisan, falls, airborne, and commandos. But I just mostly love partisans. They can attack from almost anywhere. Come out of a building, cloak, then strike when they see an AT gun or other easy target. And sniper ace is just... awesome.

So basically, in you can get a bunch of troops to harass the enemy, he will either rage-quit(90% of the time) or have a very bad front line.

Haha, you can't rage quit in real life, man! :P ;D

confusing thread lol. Keeps jumping from COH to real life.

That's where it's supposed to be, man. ;)

Come to think of it, though, i guess Hitler pretty much rage quitted, didn't he? :D

That he did. He didn't have much of a front line left though. ;D

@Loatty: I'm with tigerclawstyle on this one, I'd ask command for a bunch of NLoS howitzers. Let them pound their merry ways on the enemy's AA defences and when they are down, start doing bombing (both tactical bombings, runway cratering and interdiction) missions. Once the enemies ranks are thinned, their airforce shut down, and their communications and logistics severly hampered, I'd start making small flanking manouvres from this bulge of yours. In other words, I'd have my forces make a break, and widen (not deepen) the bulge one step at a time.

@Tico_1990: and the enemy is just going so sit there, waiting to get slaughtered? really? :o


BTW: this topic is about what you would do in real life, not COH or any game.

With the amount of forces he has (compared to the ones you gave us), it's even unlikely that there is a stalemate, so yeah.
But for argument sake: if my bombers (or at least a good number of them) are F117's, then I'll just use those to pound the crap out of the enemy AA defenses and afterwards to start pounding his army.

Nothing was stated about length of front or terrain in this problem. It is stated that a stalemate exists and the enemy outnumbers you 2:1. 3:1 is the normal ratio for victory: Your opponent is cautious. Sounds like the Ardennes. One third of your armor is obsolete: Sounds like France 1940.
Call for 2 more airfleets in support. While your waiting for support to arrive conduct a Phony War of posts and alarums. Recce to find the weak spot in the the Enemy's dispositions. When these conditions have been met take the town, cross the river, advance your Shwerpunkt  through the weakest/least accessible point in a deep penetration and disrupt rear formations and lines of communications. That's what I make of this problem.

Read Panzer Leader, Heinz Guderian  for fancy tactics.  A 2P vs 4AI easy compstomp on the Hochwald Gap map might simulate this. (High resources?). At start consider the town to be Sedan, the river to be the Meuse.

@Otto 213: wow, I'm impressed, i merely created a very basic example and you immediately link this to actual history...

your approach of this situation impresses me and i agree with your tactics.


BTW: I'm planning on reading Achtung - Panzer!, which i think is the best book on motorized warfare.

I haven't read Achtung Panzer, Die Tiger Fibel or Die Panther Fibel. I  would be particularly interested in the last two.  ;)
For good reading:
Von Mellenthin, Panzer Battles
Von Luck, Panzer Leader
Guderian Panzer Leader, what he did do rather than what he would do
Mantstein, Lost Victories
Liddel-Hart Strategy

Slightly OT but related: T. E. Lawrence, The seven Pillars of Wisdom.

Is there a good English translation of the memoirs or biography of G Zhukov?

[/]

Last edited July 22, 2011 at 6:56 PM by Otto 213

Real life?

Ill be defect to the winning side.

Why you opportunistic little... I will join you.

loatty wrote:
and when i ask everyone here to come up with plans for breaking a stalemate or crush enemy defences?

to start with something:
you have 10 divisions (7 infantry, 2 armoured and 1 elite armoured for a grand total of 180.000 men and 900 tanks, 350 of which are slightly aged)
facing you are 22 enemy divisions (a total of 350.000 men and 2000 tanks).

intelligence suggest they consist of 15 infantry, 5 armoured and 2 mechanized infantry divisions, of which 1 armoured and both mechanized infantry divisions are kept in reserve behind the lines.

lets say the front line is quite like a straight line, with one minor bulge (about 50 km deep), both under your control, on either end.

the enemy does not have superiority in the air, but has a powerfull AA defence readied and waiting.

you are given the command over a airfleet of 500 planes, of which 150 bombers, 300 fighters and 50 divebombers.



suprise me with some good tactics, guys, I'm wondering what you could make of this! :D

My military doctrine would generally call for a massive counter defence along the straight line, building miles and miles of bunkers, tank traps, and barbed wire, with complex trench systems and machine gun posts. i would also heavily fortify the bulges on either side, but have small openings in the line to allow vehicles to pass through, i would also construct it in a fashion that would ALLOW infantry to pass through freely, as a defender, but as an attacker it would seem like a maze of barbed wire and dragon's teeth. much like the siegfried line.

On the straight line defense, i would man it reasonably lightly with only 2 infantry divisions. the rest of the divisions will be stationed on the bulges, the Elite armoured division and 3 infantry divisions on the left. On the right will be 2 armoured divisions and 2 infantry divisions. the main attack would be on the right flank as a diversionary attack where it will draw some soldiers from enemies straight front line, weakening their lines further. after some time of fighting, the left hook will be unleashed and the 3 division's on the left wil drive through the enemies lines and go for their AA batteries, the 2 infantry divisions will spread to cover the holes left by the divisions. once the AA batteries have been weakened enough, the entire airfleet will engage the entire front of the enemy, forcing them into a tight and almost surrounded position. they will continually be ground into the dust and when they are about to break out, the two infantry divisions will emerge from their positions and attack them, putting even more pressure on the enemy, and finally grinding them into the dust.

Long yes, but it's a sure way of getting victory.

It's probably flawed yes, but it's what i could come up with in the short space of time.  :)

Sounds like the Siegfried Line to me :P. And we all know the Axis lost. IMO mobility and intel is key :)

Make sure supplies are able to get through then attack and keep attacking. Never stop moving. keep the enemy on the reactive instead of proactive side of the fight. dictate the terms of the engagements, flank around or simply bypass powerful fortifications.

Like the French Magniot Line :P

Fishhunterx wrote:
Like the French Magniot Line :P

aye.

Arty too weaken forces then proceed to finish off the survivors with tanks and inf