maximizing your CP gain

Well in case you havent seen it on GR.com its a long time myth that if you spend your CP's before you accumulate 3, they are gained faster. so spend your CPs when you get to 3, so your meter can reset and get the bonus

just dont be premature and force yourself into picking the wrong doctrine

going from 0 to 1 CP and 1 to 2 CP is actually gained faster than not choosing doctrines and floating 3+ CPs. who knew floating 3+ CPs made you gain slower

so no more floating 8CP into late game and playing doctrineless!
by not floating mass amounts of CPs you can actually get a calliope 15% faster, amongst others! that can be gamechanging to say the least  :o

check it out comrades!
http://www.gamereplays.org/companyofheroes/portals.php?show=page&name=company-of-heroes-coh-myths-revealed-1

Last edited July 9, 2011 at 4:45 AM by RedGuard

Everyday, we get new things to learn :D

Nice to see a long time CoH myth finally get confirmed/busted. It amazed me how many people truly believed that schwimms were weaker than ketties before the myth got busted. The CP thing is something I've wondered about for a long time.

my kettenz still stronger than schwimm  :D :P

I always pick my doctrine at the beginning of the game. Floating Command Point is fucking stupid, unless of course you're saving for something late-game.

Not to mention that you get a ton of XP (about a quarter of a Point, i think) when you spend a Point.

Just by playing the game for a short time, any n00b can figure this shit out! It's not like stats like flames vs Elite armor, which would be impossible to figure out on your own...

pariah wrote:
I always pick my doctrine at the beginning of the game. Floating Command Point is fucking stupid, unless of course you're saving for something late-game.

Not to mention that you get a ton of XP (about a quarter of a Point, i think) when you spend a Point.

Just by playing the game for a short time, any n00b can figure this shit out! It's not like stats like flames vs Elite armor, which would be impossible to figure out on your own...

Would you care to elaborate on the ton of xp comment please. Particularly how many CP you had when the expenditure granting the .25CP occurred.

In a slightly different vein: I have long held that a truly balanced game shouldn't require the use of Doctrines at all. For playtesting purposes I sometimes play without Doctrines to validate or debunk my assertion. I certainly don't advocate any tactic or strategy that "leaves money laying on the table". Your comment that you always pick your doctrine up front makes a lot of sense but many players use "delay choice of doctrine"  as a sort of "Strategic Reserve" to counter the "devious and unfairly clever opponent" ploy, (AKA Brown PAnts Syndrome). How do we best integrate the floating CP rules with Doctrinal Freedom of Choice?

I think just about every Command Point you spend will gain you more Experience Points (approximately a quarter of a C.P.), but i'd have to test it again.

I completely agree that doctrines shouldn't be required to win. If nobody is using them, it should still be a totally balanced game.

Personally, how quickly i spend my points depends on the doctrine. Usually i go for whatever's cheapest, but sometimes i'll save. For example, i don't get much use out of the aircraft in the Airborne Company Commander, so instead of spending 1 Point on Recon, i'll save up for Paratroopers, and continue down that side (forget what it's called :-[).

P.S. R.I.P. my 1337 posts. :'(

It is not a quarter of a CP. It is much less than that. It is visible. Pretty helpful feature if you are achingly close to the CP which grants you the tiger ace. Just get the one before it and abracadabra you get the tiger ace to crush conscripts.

Tankbuster wrote:
It is not a quarter of a CP. It is much less than that. It is visible.

It is a quarter and its not that visible unless you have 2,98CP (allmost 3) and use a point or 2 then.

One CP    One complete circle => Visible
1/4 CP    1/4th circle => Not that Visible
<1/4 CP  less than 1/4th circle  =>Clearly visible (to me at least) :P
From the above 3 expressions we have a paradox. ::)
Ex Half-life Opposing force. ;D
Seriously, It is not much less than a quarter and it can be approximated to one (quarter).
I hope I have not offended anyone. If I have, Please find it in your
heart(s) to forgive me.

I've been futzing around with the CP meter trying to optimize when to activate various options. I have some observations that may be useful to you all.

1. When observing the CP wheel think in terms of rotation not xp. THat is to say at 60 xp/CP 20xp = 120degrees of rotation. 80xp/CP implies 20xp = 90degrees of rotation.


2. At 180xp the wheel reads 2.75 rotations (3/4 of a green ring). If you activate a 1CP option at this point the wheel will reset to 2.0 rotations, (no green ring). ie you have 120xp available. no bonus xp for getting a CP.


3. At 201xp the wheel reads 3.0+ rotations, (a little green in the ring). If you activate a 1CP option at this point the wheel will reset to ~2.126+ rotations, (about 45 degrees of green in the ring). You have spent about 70 xp for your 1CP option! No bonus xp and you have paid a premium over what is implied by the GR table.  ???


4. Activating 1 Cp when the wheel reads 2.0 or 3.0 revolutions (no green ring) the wheel resets to 1.0 or 2.0 revolutions, (No green ring). You have spent 60xp or 80 xp for your CP. Again no bonus xps.  :P


5. The morale of the story so far: Wait for a little green to show before you Activate your CPs
   

Off topic, but I also have a myth sort of question.  Do you still get the resources from a point WHILE it is being decapped?

Also, floating CPs is far from stupid.  Sometimes you need to wait until the situation unfolds (which could take a while) before you make your choice on which doctrine you need to counter the type of threats on the field.  This is especially true for PE (ie: Hummels)

Yauz wrote:
Off topic, but I also have a myth sort of question.  Do you still get the resources from a point WHILE it is being decapped?

I believe you do. I  have looked at muni's in ths regard. Perhaps not a valid observation because of muni-maintenance cost rules.

QuoteAlso, floating CPs is far from stupid.  Sometimes you need to wait until the situation unfolds (which could take a while) before you make your choice on which doctrine you need to counter the type of threats on the field.  This is especially true for PE (ie: Hummels)

+1
What is the cooldown time for Kets boobytrap in EF_v1.4.0? I am investigating a possible bug but unfortunately cannot access EF at this time. I think the cool-down rate is halved after PE gets BT SP doctrine. Is this correct?

Otto wrote:

Yauz wrote:
Off topic, but I also have a myth sort of question.  Do you still get the resources from a point WHILE it is being decapped?

I believe you do. I  have looked at muni's in ths regard. Perhaps not a valid observation because of muni-maintenance cost rules.

QuoteAlso, floating CPs is far from stupid.  Sometimes you need to wait until the situation unfolds (which could take a while) before you make your choice on which doctrine you need to counter the type of threats on the field.  This is especially true for PE (ie: Hummels)

+1
What is the cooldown time for Kets boobytrap in EF_v1.4.0? I am investigating a possible bug but unfortunately cannot access EF at this time. I think the cool-down rate is halved after PE gets BT SP doctrine. Is this correct?

Well, sort of.

The booby trap ability has a cooldown of 120 secs. When you get BT SP the cooldown would be of 25 secs.

What does "BT SP" mean? I noticed that the Kettenkrad Booby Traps have an extremely long cool-down time, but at some point in the game, it will get reduced significantly. I never could pin-point the trigger for that to happen... :-\

Booby trap strategic points - 2nd ability on the LHS of scorched earth. It reduces the cooldown of the ketty booby trap from 120 to 25s.

Sweet! Thanks, mate. I'll have to remember that for when i play Panzer Elite again.

Ahh, I already noticed this a year ago, just didn't know it was a super myth!

Seeme wrote:
Ahh, I already noticed this a year ago, just didn't know it was a super myth!

well, some ppl, like me don't care about things like that. Somebody made it 120 secs, so let it be. That's why balance isn't my favourite stuff to do  :P

I gotta say, i prefer it like that. It's so you can't spam Booby Traps at the beginning of the game. It's a good idea to not get the quicker recharge until later. ;)

The panzerelite has a lot of "hidden" abilitys.

I.e. the panzergrenadiers get a mobility bonus if the panzer jäger kommand has been constructed (source: Corsixs mod studio).

GodlikeDennis wrote:
It amazed me how many people truly believed that schwimms were weaker than ketties before the myth got busted...

Could this myth be revisited. I don't imagine Schwimms are weaker than Kets but I have never been able to get as much utility from them as I do with Kets.

Otto wrote:

GodlikeDennis wrote:
It amazed me how many people truly believed that schwimms were weaker than ketties before the myth got busted...

Could this myth be revisited. I don't imagine Schwimms are weaker than Kets but I have never been able to get as much utility from them as I do with Kets.

The only practical useful skill on the Ketten is the Luftwaffe's camo ability to scout for the 88 and Marder.  The other 2 skills are useless.  For the Swim, all three skills are useless, which makes it, along with the Hotchkiss, the most useless reward unit from the whole ToV selection.

You really got to ask yourself: Do I seriously need to select a different unit (with the same stats) for the sole purpose of just capping points?

Ketty/Schwimm are identical except for their abilities and the Schwimm is faster across water. I would say the only useful abilities are stealth on the luft ketty and mines on the TH Schwimm.

TD repair is handy for me when PGs are running around chasing grunts and you have low health ACs/HTs

cloaked ketten + Nashorn are very powerful

THe mine laying ability is much better on the Schwimm than on the MuniHT. It can get into tighter places.
The repair ability on the ket is most helpful in supporting front line units. I assume it takes triple damage, but it also absorbs a good number of sniper shots.
The best of the Kets abilities IMO is boobytrap SP. I have never discovered a counter to those boobytraps and Strategic use of the ket really can be helpful early game. I hope BB gets to the bottom of the recharge glitch vis a vis recharge rate/Defensive Ops. It works right in 2.602 but not v1.4.0.

Yea, Booby traps is really great early game. If the opponent dosent notice, they get creamed. Or it at least delays the capping.

And Don't underestimate the power of Mark Target (Schwimmwagen/Luftwaffe). ;)

The problem with the other 2 abilities of the ketten aside from cloak and all 3 abilities on the swim is that they have little practical use in higher level play.  They look good on paper, but they actually suck.

An example is like the TH ketten repair.  Yea you could argue that "wow! the ketten can now repair everything!"  But when you actually think about it, your ketten would probably be more useful capping more points than actually helping repair with its shitty repair rate.  If left alone to repair a low health AC alone, it would probably take it a over a full minute...  Same with the Swim mine laying thing.  How many times do you actually use it in a game?  Perhaps once or twice, considering the cooldown, and a regular mine is better anyways.

As I mentioned in my previous posts, the only ability that outshines capping would be spotting for the 88 / Marder from the Luftwaffe camo.  There's actually times that the whole balance of the game depends on whether you went Luftwaffe AND ketten or not, since spotting is so crucial sometimes.  Luft cloak is also the only way you can spot for well protected snipers in higher level play too.  Good luck trying to reveal snipers with a swim or a uncloaked ket...you will get raped by AT gun / small arms fire before you even get close.

Last edited July 21, 2011 at 5:31 PM by Yauz

I agree with the Kettenkrad Repair, but the Cloak i don't find very useful. Sure, it can come in handy in the ways you said, but the reduced speed means it will likely get spotted anyway, either by not being able to escape advancing enemies, or having to de-cloak to get away.

And Schwimmwagen Mines can be real handy. It's a fast little unit, so it can get in there and place Mines much quicker than infantry. Similar to the Greyhound, but obviously not as effective.

Kettenkrad camo + Nashorn = Death to the enemy tanks