Trenches/heavy cover

So it's been awhile since we have heard about the Ostheers system for heavy cover. Would you guys be able to give us an idea of what you're doing with it? Have you come to a conclusion yet?

Now you mention it... nope ;D.

Haha. ;D Well i stand by my opinion that they should use inverted Sand Bags-type trenches. Looking forward to seeing what you guys do nonetheless.

I think a non-doctrinal bunker system would be appropriate in Ostheer just as the Soviet style "underground" outpost system reflects the "Russian approach to heavy cover. I realize that is not likely to happen though.

Light Cover: Snow banks.

I would like to see more weather/time of day effects in EF. From what has been said elsewhere the only weather effects in CoH involve the unit voice-overs. ??? Colonel Mud and General Winter have always played an important role in "Eastern Front" conflicts.

Weather affects won't be included, at least in multiplayer/skirmish, because it rather changes the gameplay.

Buildable light cover isn't a good idea, because it just wouldn't be worth it.

Maybe doctrines could affect what types of cover you can build, but i dunno about that... :-\

pariah wrote:
Weather affects won't be included, at least in multiplayer/skirmish, because it rather changes the gameplay.

Buildable light cover isn't a good idea, because it just wouldn't be worth it.

Maybe doctrines could affect what types of cover you can build, but i dunno about that... :-\

Ehh? What are sandbags? Macaroni?

The notion that weather effects or nighttime reduction of LOS won't be included because of changed game play sits poorly with me. It would enhance good gameplay. If it was a technical issue or even a balance issue I might buy your reasoning.

Last edited July 8, 2011 at 3:33 AM by Otto 213

I think it's both a technical issue and a gameplay issue. Nothing at the moment exists for weather conditions affecting gameplay so I don't know how hard it would be to code.

Weather effects would be a great idea for a campaign mission or two though. Harsh snowstorm that reduces troop movement speed to 1 and reduces LoS dramatically? That's easy to code by having the units in that particular mission having lower stats.

Sounds like a Battle of Bulge map  :P.

match start: daytime
match end: stormy snowfalling afternoon
and of course the LoS and the movement speed has been decreased.

QuoteHaha. ;D Well i stand by my opinion that they should use inverted Sand Bags-type trenches. Looking forward to seeing what you guys do nonetheless.

I guess you think about something like this:

Re buildable heavy cover. Roadblocks work well for me. If a area weapon strike comes in you have time to react. A proper dismount takes too much micro. hot key dismount is likely to dump your troops from the frying pan to the fire.

@GlD I can see hardcoding issues with weather too. The night LOS reduction should be do able, smoke afterall is a time related function. When playing with the Orel map the factions attacking uphill are at a disadvantage. It is always somewhat dramatic when the sun comes up. It would be nice to utilize  the darkness somehow. "Surrender to the will of the night".

walki1 wrote:
I guess you think about something like this:

Yep, just like that. Maybe built more like Trenches (or Roadblocks? :-\) than Sandbags, but rather than garrisoning them to get insane cover, you just walk in there like normal for heavy cover to the front and back, but obviously not the side.

I like this idea very much. I had a similar one but never brought it up because I didn't even know it was possible.

+1 for (not slit) Trenches.

Well, that's the thing - I'm not sure if it is actually possible. Thought it was worth throwing out there, anyway.

I thought maybe the Ostheer should get normal Sand Bags like the other factions, but get these trenches from a doctrine, since they offer better cover, and are much harder to destroy.

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Had a look at the doctrines again, and i think it would fit here:

QuoteArmy Fortress Troops

Improved Defences

Improved Fortifications - 2CP (Pioneers can construct Panzernests and Tripwires)

Will Ostheer get access to the standard Sand Bags? If so, these trenches could replace them when you unlock the above.

Last edited July 16, 2011 at 7:38 PM by pariah

Not replace, but perhaps supplement.

Replacement would be back because although the Trench would be better in a field, Sandbags are much more versatile in where they can be placed.

QuoteSturmpioneers
Role: Assault Engineers
Weapons: 2xFlammenwerfer + 2xMP40.
Abilities: Detect Mines(passive), Barbed Wire, Sandbags, Czech Hedgehogs, Deploy Mines, Run(requires Blitz Pioneers), Goliath(requires Blitz Pioneers), Trench(requires Fortress Pioneers), S-Mines(requires Fortress Pioneers).

from OH sneaks: they can build BOTH sandbags and trenches (whatever they will look like  ???).
small note: to build trenches they must be upgraded to "Fortress Pioneers" first (individual unit upgrade like british recon squad).

Last edited July 23, 2011 at 6:01 PM by Ghost

Thanks for that!

Fianlly some trenches you can left they for ostheer  ;D
SU have a lot of stuff how to take down garrisoned trench
with no doc you have flamers, of course molotovs , sattle charges.


sorry of my english

OH will also be balanced against US and Brits. The latter don't have a means to defeat trenches, and trenches are lame in general, so OH won't have trenches.

GodlikeDennis wrote:
OH will also be balanced against US and Brits. The latter don't have a means to defeat trenches, and trenches are lame in general, so OH won't have trenches.

Rifle grenades are long-ranged flamethrowers, you do know that right? Theyre much more accurate vs units in cover or in garrison (including trenches), and blow vs units out in the open (hence their sometimes fail performance). Brits do, in fact, have a means of dealing with units in trenches (I  really do hope the devs are aware of this fact. Itd be scary if they cant read corsix well enough to see it  ;) )

You do know that riflenades do not have the accuracy to be considered reliable anti-trench measures right? It would be scary if you necroed this pointless thread just to speak crap.

US has a flamethrower. But I dont really think Tommies have a quick reliable way to flush trenches out :P

Slit trenches wouldn't be op if tanks could crush their occupants

That would make for some interesting game play and for a potential COH video  ;D

What about give a limit on trenchs, ostheer can buid trenches but just one at time
one trench can hold a bridge but on all maps they can control only one or two points
good idea, isnt it ? ;)

Red wrote:
What about give a limit on trenchs, ostheer can buid trenches but just one at time
one trench can hold a bridge but on all maps they can control only one or two points
good idea, isnt it ? ;)

Sorry but when you make a suggestion an mention bridge then we have to flatly decline.

Osheer trenches are not like Brit trenches

@Red Banner
We still need to discuss what kind of "trenches" Ostheer will use or if they will use them at all.

Last edited February 18, 2012 at 5:30 PM by blackbishop

aha, okey, i agree

aha, okey, i agree
im looking foward to see new tipe one
BTW nice work with 1.600