[[IP address redacted]] Conscripts

How about just put a commissar as the squad leader from the start purely for the sake of art purposes?

Last edited June 13, 2011 at 9:03 PM by Yauz

Yauz wrote:
How about just put a commissar as the squad leader from the start purely for the sake of art purposes?

That could be possible... don't know if could be accepted though.

and give him a mosin  :o ?

cephalos wrote:
and give him a mosin  :o ?

Nah, give him a pistol and treat him like any other concript until vet. The commissar is just a politico not a soldier and iirc from one of Stormovic's (sic), posts many commissars were executed for incompetence.

cephalos wrote:
and give him a mosin  :o ?

Yes. He would use a mosin, like all the other conscripts. I think that would look weird and i think is the main reason to not change them.

Otto wrote:

cephalos wrote:
and give him a mosin  :o ?

Nah, give him a pistol and treat him like any other concript until vet. The commissar is just a politico not a soldier and iirc from one of Stormovic's (sic), posts many commissars were executed for incompetence.

Nope, changing the art file would be easy, mixing the pistol with the mosin rule wouldn't be wise at this stage. That's why we won't implement him as squad leader.

Last edited June 13, 2011 at 9:29 PM by blackbishop

what about giving him a Ppsh with semi-round fire? Like squad's leader Mp44 in Grendaiers and Volks squads? make stats exaclty same as mosins one and juts change model? We would have then 7 mosins and ppsh, which is exacly the same as mosin.

cephalos wrote:
what about giving him a Ppsh with semi-round fire? Like squad's leader Mp44 in Grendaiers and Volks squads? make stats exaclty same as mosins one and juts change model? We would have then 7 mosins and ppsh, which is exacly the same as mosin.

And when he dies another conscript will grab his ppsh, the officer will arrive without weapons if there are 4 conscripts left or more.

blackbishop wrote:

cephalos wrote:
what about giving him a Ppsh with semi-round fire? Like squad's leader Mp44 in Grendaiers and Volks squads? make stats exaclty same as mosins one and juts change model? We would have then 7 mosins and ppsh, which is exacly the same as mosin.

And when he dies another conscript will grab his ppsh, the officer will arrive without weapons if there are 4 conscripts left or more.

lol, didn't think about that  ;D

blackbishop wrote:

cephalos wrote:
what about giving him a Ppsh with semi-round fire? Like squad's leader Mp44 in Grendaiers and Volks squads? make stats exaclty same as mosins one and juts change model? We would have then 7 mosins and ppsh, which is exacly the same as mosin.

And when he dies another conscript will grab his ppsh, the officer will arrive without weapons if there are 4 conscripts left or more.

thats ok hes there to inspire

What if the only weapon he gets is a tokarev from the beginning?  Would the pistol also be replaced by mosin after vet2?

I think to be unsupressable should be a timed ability like the command squad. If the comissar dies the ability is gone till he is reinforced.

Killar wrote:
What if the only weapon he gets is a tokarev from the beginning?  Would the pistol also be replaced by mosin after vet2?

I think to be unsupressable should be a timed ability like the command squad. If the comissar dies the ability is gone till he is reinforced.

That Idea is actually quite good. Add a commissar to the squad and give them the "unsupressable" timed ability unlocked @vet 3.

dArCReAvEr wrote:

Killar wrote:
What if the only weapon he gets is a tokarev from the beginning?  Would the pistol also be replaced by mosin after vet2?

I think to be unsupressable should be a timed ability like the command squad. If the comissar dies the ability is gone till he is reinforced.

That Idea is actually quite good. Add a commissar to the squad and give them the "unsupressable" timed ability unlocked @vet 3.

Don't you mean more or less resurrecting the Execute ability from Penals :P. But yeah sounds better than the current arrangement for conscripts +1

Last edited June 14, 2011 at 2:53 PM by Raider217

Like DOW

MG42 don't need to be changed in any way, as in 2602 it is perfectly balanced. Players talking about MG42 "too overpower", "packing time too fast", etc, its because they don't know how to flank correctly with Riflemans (or Molotov Conscripts/PPSH RBS ;)).

About topic subject: I think Conscript Veterancy needs a buff. They are gaining veterancy tooooo slow. Its to dificult to have a Vet2 conscript in a 30 min game!!!

PS: posted just to give my opinion, as I already read that dev's are tweaking the Conscript vet for next patch.

Conscripts will not have veterancy at all next patch.

2.602 has awful balance. Volks are far too cheap and the MG42 buff was unnecessary. The pack up speed makes MG + bike combos extremely strong at the start and sets the Wehr player up for a steamroll mid/lategame.

yeah but the changes the devs made to the conscripts are a good compromise to the vet i think

but you will see it when the patch becomes final :D

GodlikeDennis wrote:
Conscripts will not have veterancy at all next patch.

2.602 has awful balance. Volks are far too cheap and the MG42 buff was unnecessary. The pack up speed makes MG + bike combos extremely strong at the start and sets the Wehr player up for a steamroll mid/lategame.

LOL. Denis, I play CoH since beta and can say that the 2.602 has the best balance EVER on all patchs of CoH since introduction of Brtit/PE on OF.

The buff on MG packing is too smal and necessary because the great buff on flamer (also necessary) that is used for flanking.

But i'm ok with conscripts don't having vet if they receive 4 aditional rifles on a cheap upgrade.

PS: I tottally disagree with vet 3 Conscripts being unsupressable, this would make useless the CS fire up, and make obsolete PPSH RBS. And beside that, Soviets already have so much ways to deal with mg's (CS art, sharpshoter, sharpshoter art, mortar, PPSH RBS, normal conscript flanking, etc).

Last edited July 2, 2011 at 2:42 AM by SuperSoca

^^2.602 is one of the biggest fail patches ever released in cohs wacky history

gamereplays is ripe with rants from well respected and skilled players

Last edited July 2, 2011 at 4:42 AM by RedGuard

Why you say that RedGuard? I like to hear.

I do not understand how the Molotov cocktail does damage to a TIGER! :o!

Volk miniscule reinforce cost makes med bunker strats even better than before. MG packup time means that with bike push, it's extremely difficult to take out even a single MG. Wehr loses practically no MP in the early game from reinforcement but US has to pay out the ass for it. G43s are fucked now. Too much early game balance was messed with in the last patch. PE only needed the AT buffs. Wehr only needed a slight reduction to volk reinforce and the volk capping speed buff at skirmish phase. 2.601 had better balance in total barring roos. Brits were already fucked before, and completely fucked now.

I'm curious to know WTF happened with G43.  It was supposed to be a minor to medicore buff.  They used to suck so badly.  Now they rape face pretty damn hard.  I used to never get them.  Now, I don't even get Mp44s anymore lol

Last edited July 2, 2011 at 5:39 AM by Yauz

Amazing how often Dennis uses the word fuck :D

It's an Australian thing I guess. I try to tone it down but I was in a bad mood when I posted that one.

Ha ha, I don't believe its an Australian thing, my friend, we all try to be civilised when we can :P


(Though its pretty ironic since the word originated in Britain when a TV producer said it by complete accident :D)

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I'm really looking forward to the conscript changes though :P

What was the purpose to delete the conscipts vet?

Plp dont build Strelky because of the conscripts, but of the op Guards. The lack of strengh of the guards in the next patch and the weakness of the cons leaves the player no other choice than to build strelky (even tech to RBS).

Deleting vet for conscripts is needless and makes this unit even more weak. Currently even the full rifles and the unsupressable ability at vetIII gives me no reason to waste my MP for a new squad in late game.The soldiers health is so weak that you will loose the squad even if you retreat in time. Saying that even the full rifles dont do enough damage against vetII or vetIII gren squads.

Currently i build 3 Squads of conscipts in early and no more. I keep them alive till late game where i usually loose them by ninja capping (as a fighting unit they are useless). So vetII or even vetIII conscipts are common. To support my Strelkys i build guards or Sturmovie ingenery NOT conscipts.

With deleting vet (and balance that by maybe make them cheaper by buying other upgrades, which is senseless because nobody will buy them later on) i dont know why is should waste my mp on them in middle game. On the other hand, wheni keep them in base, the lack of the soldiers would make a difference at the front.

The acutal vet system is ok i think:

Vet1: nothin yet (recrewing is chancelled) -> early game
Vet2: full rifles -> middle game
Vet3: unsupressable (which sould be a timed ability) -> late game

With the actual system their health per man and armor type wont change by gaining vet. So they will remain in late as weak as in early game

PS: pls change the MP cost. 224 MP??? to keep the balance i would make them even more expensive but not more than 250MP

The conscript vet removal was not a balance change. We had nothing to do with it. It was a design decision by the devs.

What we are implementing is having conscript reinforcement cost reduced throughout the game. For each tech research you get (close range support, medium range support, light tankovy, heavy tankovy) it will reduce the conscript reinforcement by 2MP. So conscripts begin with a 16MP reinforce which will scale down to possibly 10-8 in lategame.

GodlikeDennis wrote:
The conscript vet removal was not a balance change. We had nothing to do with it. It was a design decision by the devs.

Wonder what made the Devs delete vetting for one unit other than balance. I know that consis are buggy but full rifles and unsuppressability always worked for me (Recrewing doesnt work when gaining it by vet, i know)

Is it possible to link lower reinforcment costs to vet?

vet1: lower reinforcment costs
vet2: full rifles
vet3: unsepressable (timed ability)

Last edited July 2, 2011 at 3:02 PM by Killar

Yes, it's possible.

But as looks like conscript vet bonii won't return...

Killar, its normal that some units turn obsolete as the game go on. You can see wher: Volks is useless in mid/end game, except to recrew.

SuperSoca wrote:
Killar, its normal that some units turn obsolete as the game go on. You can see wher: Volks is useless in mid/end game, except to recrew.

No its not. Vet3 Volks are still powerful in lategame. And conscripts are not the same as Volks

any wehr infantry is a potential powerhouse late game, med bunkers?  ;)

Killar wrote:

SuperSoca wrote:
Killar, its normal that some units turn obsolete as the game go on. You can see wher: Volks is useless in mid/end game, except to recrew.

No its not. Vet3 Volks are still powerful in lategame. And conscripts are not the same as Volks

The problem is, Conscripts were designed in that way, to be obsolete after mid game.

I don't wanna badmouth the devs, even though I thoroughly disagree with that change. Maybe we should lock this thread.