[[IP address redacted]] Sniperteam artillery

Hi,
I played a game about 10 minutes ago and noticed something again. I played as soviet and I built a sniperteam. After that I upgraded them to artillery spotter for 125 ammo. I bashed vehicles and tanks with them!

The point is that you are able to call in the artillery of the lieutenant and of the captain for free but as a british it costs 150 for each barrage. I think that's a way overpowered. I would suggest making sniper teams able to call in artillery for 150 ammo every time like the british command units or reduce the artillerys damage.

Or perhaps the barrage itself could use a nerf? I know Munitions is pretty scarce for the Soviets...

Then a high munitions upkeep would be nice for artillery spotter.

The barrage will be a little funkier in 1.4, but I'm inclined to agree that the barrage could do with a nerf, maybe increase the cooldown time to counter over-use.

Yeah, i think increasing the cool-down would be good, but i was thinking maybe you should change it to a Mortar Barrage ability, like that of the Wehrmacht Leutnant?

walki1 wrote:
Hi,
I played a game about 10 minutes ago and noticed something again. I played as soviet and I built a sniperteam. After that I upgraded them to artillery spotter for 125 ammo. I bashed vehicles and tanks with them!

The point is that you are able to call in the artillery of the lieutenant and of the captain for free but as a british it costs 150 for each barrage. I think that's a way overpowered. I would suggest making sniper teams able to call in artillery for 150 ammo every time like the british command units or reduce the artillerys damage.

How much do you pay for an arty barrage from a Stuka after you upgrade it for....125 muni?
Why is it directly comparable to the british arty instead of the Stuka?
Remind me the resource bonus of Brits?
With the up-comming health nerf of the sniper, lets see how easy it is to keep them around and do the arty strikes...

Last edited May 9, 2011 at 5:21 PM by Zerstörer

QuoteWhy is it directly comparable to the british arty instead of the Stuka?

because IT IS the british arty.

Stuka can't be compared because it doesn't pin and has 6 shots instead of 7. Including one directly after you called in.

Also remember that the Halftrack has no offensive abilities aside from the barrage, whereas the Sniper, you know, snipes...

walki1 wrote:

QuoteWhy is it directly comparable to the british arty instead of the Stuka?

because IT IS the british arty.

Stuka can't be compared because it doesn't pin and has 6 shots instead of 7. Including one directly after you called in.

It's a unit you upgrade so it can perform artillery strikes-Just like the stuka
The fact that the arty shells do different damage is irrelevant.
British do NOT pay an upgrade to get the arty strike

Halftrack is alot more survivable and fires the barrage from safe distance- pros and cons people....

they also do NOT have a global timer meaning no matter how many snipers you get on the field, you can only use the ability once and then wait for re-charge

Last edited May 9, 2011 at 5:32 PM by Zerstörer

Lieutenant and Captain arty barrages are doctrinal.

What you need to take into consideration when balancing isn't just the ability, nor the unit; You need to consider the whole faction.

Bottom line - Is the Sniper Team arty barrage overpowered? Does it make the Soviet Union overpowered? If so, what can we do to nerf it?

And you've...played with the soviets? Played the balance patch to take into account the sniper nerf?

You mean the health nerf? No, of course not...

BurroDiablo wrote:
The barrage will be a little funkier in 1.4, but I'm inclined to agree that the barrage could do with a nerf, maybe increase the cooldown time to counter over-use.

If some change may be committed to the sniper barrage this is the wisest solution.

Perhaps as sniper team earns vet their cooldown could be reduced.

blackbishop wrote:
Perhaps as sniper team earns vet their cooldown could be reduced.

Shouldn't it already be like that? It makes sense to me...

pariah wrote:

blackbishop wrote:
Perhaps as sniper team earns vet their cooldown could be reduced.

Shouldn't it already be like that? It makes sense to me...

Nope, any arty call-in like that have their cooldown reduced by vet afaik.

Of course, it's comparable with the stuka upgrade but that doesn't mean it should have the same stats.

Hold on, i'm confused now... Do the Soviet Sniper Teams already get a cool-down decrease on their arty barrages as their veterancy level increases or not? Because i think it only makes sense that they do, since it gives vet more use, plus pretty much all other units do.

no they dont its not a bad idea since they've been nerfed, and they already have global cooldown, rendering multiple arty upgrades useless

Last edited May 9, 2011 at 6:29 PM by RedGuard

Thanks, mate. :) It is hard to help in lieu of that, but i do my best. :(

So, what does everybody think this ability needs? Less damage? Cool-down modifier? A price per usage? What?

I think its fine the way it is honestly, the only balance concerns about SU SS seem to be their health. which the team is working out. price per usage, btw, goes against soviet design  :(

pariah wrote:
Hold on, i'm confused now... Do the Soviet Sniper Teams already get a cool-down decrease on their arty barrages as their veterancy level increases or not? Because i think it only makes sense that they do, since it gives vet more use, plus pretty much all other units do.

Neither Officer nor CW Lt./Captain off-map barrages benefit from vet. The only thing similar between sniper barrage and stuka barrage is that you need to purchase them. So, you cannot compare those abilities in that way (this is reasoning the cooldown not being implemented as default).

pariah wrote:
Thanks, mate. :) It is hard to help in lieu of that, but i do my best. :(

So, what does everybody think this ability needs? Less damage? Cool-down modifier? A price per usage? What?

Nope, a price tag for barrage is a no-no.

Last edited May 9, 2011 at 6:53 PM by blackbishop

Firstly, i said "pretty much", since i couldn't think of any that don't, so it was just a precaution. I was thinking mostly of the Wehrmacht Halftrack, Nebelwerfer, Hotchkiss, and American Howitzer, since they get reduced cool-down times with vet. Whether you should implement that into the Soviet Sniper stats or not i can't say.

Secondly, i had already stated that i think that a price for Sniper arty is a bad thing, with the Munitions upkeep. I was looking for what people think should be done (if anything) to nerf the barrage, not what should not be done. ;)

The barrage is not in need of a nerf, its very limited as-is already.
We believe the issue to be somewhere in between hitpoints and armor

QuoteSo, what does everybody think this ability needs? Less damage? Cool-down modifier? A price per usage? What?

Arty change. Why? Because like other people said, SU sniper is using british arty. We know that british arty is specific, fairly quickly after a call arty, 1 bullet hit the ground, what causes supressed all infantry and then incoming the rest of bullets. There is no chance (nah maybe is but small)  to escape from arty arena, so you must run to base. You have only about 3 sec from seeing flares to run from arty arena.

My proposition is easy. Give the SU sniper USA arty. You have about 5 sec from seeing flares to run from arty arena and this arty have bigger dispersion, so it shouldn't be that OP like british one.

The rest of SU sniper preferences should stay.

TheDzierzanPL wrote:

QuoteSo, what does everybody think this ability needs? Less damage? Cool-down modifier? A price per usage? What?

Arty change. Why? Because like other people said, SU sniper is using british arty. We know that british arty is specific, fairly quickly after a call arty, 1 bullet hit the ground, what causes supressed all infantry and then incoming the rest of bullets. There is no chance (nah maybe is but small)  to escape from arty arena, so you must run to base. You have only about 3 sec from seeing flares to run from arty arena.

My proposition is easy. Give the SU sniper USA arty. You have about 5 sec from seeing flares to run from arty arena and this arty have bigger dispersion, so it shouldn't be that OP like british one.

The rest of SU sniper preferences should stay.

That doesn't holds weight currently, because Sniper Arty is way different ;D. It's so different that you must wait for 1.40 to have an opinion about it.

Well if that's the case, this topic doesn't have much value, does it? ;)

I suggest we come back to this issue if we need to when the next update is out.

Just close this one, since for any reasonable discussion we require an update, that will come... some day.