Best army of WW2

It is a simple but complex question; who was the best army during WW2? You can use equipment, battlefield victories, training, anything as a reason for who you thought was the best army.
For me, i would say the German army (not those SS idiots, those f****** cowards) were the best. They had good infantry tactics, decent armor, a good air force, and a decent submarine fleet. Had it not been for the Nazis, Germany would have won the war in Europe. It was only for the ideological a****** that the Nazis were that cause Germany's downfall. The German people were great, they were just exploited by the Nazis to do their dirty work, and for that, everyone seems to think that every German was a Nazi. Next time you see a German WW2 veteran, ask him if he served in the normal German army. If he says yes, then don't call him a Nazis. It is an insult to their military pride and honor.

It smell the flame war... doesn't it?  ;D

Panzer4life wrote:
It is a simple but complex question; who was the best army during WW2? You can use equipment, battlefield victories, training, anything as a reason for who you thought was the best army.
For me, i would say the German army (not those SS idiots, those f****** cowards) were the best. They had good infantry tactics, decent armor, a good air force, and a decent submarine fleet. Had it not been for the Nazis, Germany would have won the war in Europe. It was only for the ideological a****** that the Nazis were that cause Germany's downfall. The German people were great, they were just exploited by the Nazis to do their dirty work, and for that, everyone seems to think that every German was a Nazi. Next time you see a German WW2 veteran, ask him if he served in the normal German army. If he says yes, then don't call him a Nazis. It is an insult to their military pride and honor.

Let me ask you few simple things, my friend (I hope, I have reasons to call you that way, since the both of us "dislike" fascists): If the beloved faterla:nd (and I'm sure it was beloved by it's sons) had won, would we be living in a world of simply prevailing Germany, or would it be that very Third Reich? Would I and several hundred million those like myself be living at all, as we all are of by all means of non true arian origin, born and living in places, that were supposed to be "clensed" off us, "untermenshen", in order to create the "living space" for your ancestors, and you in perspective? Would Germany ever start that God damned war at all, if it were not for fascists, and for what such purpose would it do so?
What I mean, is that this bitter part of our common history always has to remain a sharp picture in our minds. We should never let our national pride to obscure it in any degree. As I am not proud, no I am shamed by all those atrocities, committed by the soviet regime and of all those who took part in it in any way, so should you be on your side ashamed of dark moments history of your nation and it's people.
Concluding said, for the reasons mentioned above, it is unethical to admire fascist army in any way or any part. In fact I can play this game for the german side only when I absolutely abstract myself from the Earth realm.
I hope, you do understand, I am not trying to offend your national identity in any possible way.

IJoe, I am an American, and there is two things were believe in, one is that man deserves freedom, and the second is that any man who is oppressed will rise up and defeat his enemy. If the German army had won, and there were still the Nazis (Hitler had by war ends at least been the target of assassination attempt 43 times), the people under German rule would rise up and kill every single last fascist in retaliation of those that had died by their hands. And Germans by wars end were trying to kill Nazis; they were learning of the war crimes of what the Nazis had done and were trying to knock off high Nazis leaders. So rest my friend, if the Germans had won, there wouldn't be any fasisct left living.

Panzer4life wrote:
IJoe, I am an American, and there is two things were believe in, one is that man deserves freedom, and the second is that any man who is oppressed will rise up and defeat his enemy. If the German army had won, and there were still the Nazis (Hitler had by war ends at least been the target of assassination attempt 43 times), the people under German rule would rise up and kill every single last fascist in retaliation of those that had died by their hands. And Germans by wars end were trying to kill Nazis; they were learning of the war crimes of what the Nazis had done and were trying to knock off high Nazis leaders. So rest my friend, if the Germans had won, there wouldn't be any fasisct left living.

Sorry, but it sounds like a fairy tail about Snow-white and seven dwarfs. Well, I don't blame you, since you are american,- you can allow yourself such fantasies on a theme, that is so unspeakably far from touching your very self, as you haven't sucked with the milk of your mother the ever burning hatred for fascism and cruel determination to crush it, whenever it rises it's ugly head as most of my sane fellow countrymen of my generation. Maybe that is the very reason why american government after the ww2 hired hundreds of fascists (and I mean the members of fascist party), including chiefs of infamous Gestapo etc - it's all about freedom, right?

P.S.: Here's some food for your freedom-loving mind:
"Somoza may be a son of a bitch, but he's our son of a bitch" President Franklin D. Roosevelt (one of the most democratic presidents of the US of A) And do things ever change in that magical country?
Anastasio Somoza García (1896-1956) was a Nicaraguan General, President, and dictator from 1936 to 1956. His administration, while being one of the most corrupt in history and brutal to dissidents, was nevertheless supported by the United States because it was viewed as anti-communist.

IJoe, I'd like to point out that the Russians were just as good at hiring Nazi Scientists and such after the war as the Americans were.
That being said, I'd say that it depends on the way you look at it. If you look at the outcome of the conflict, than the Germans were by no means the best army. However, the Germans were smothered/overwhelmed by the allied numbers. In my non proffesional opinion, I'd say that technologically, tactically, and strategically, the Germans had, by far, the best army, especially at the start of the war.
This however does not mean that I admire the facist army, I simply recognise the fact that they were better at waging war than the others (again, I'm talking about the start of the war here).
I'd also like to point out that it is incorrect to talk about the Germans as Facists. Fascist is derived from Fasces, a Roman symbol of power. Fascism specifically refers to the Italian regime of Mussolini. The German regime of WW2 ought to be called Nazism or National Socialism. If you want to use a term which works for both, than you could call them Totalitarian regimes. Please note, Stalin's regime is a totalitarian one as well.

Cheers

Well, thank you for that most unneeded remark (no offence here), for I have two university degrees  ;)
Nazi scientists and fascist (lets cut it to that short for the simplicity of any further statements), especially one's, who performed their "duties" in Gestapo, are really as distant from one another as are a lamb and a wolf (in biblical terms).
Moreover the name of the topic is "Best army of WW2" as you could definitely read, not "the best\most ready to combat army at the awke of WW2"
May I consider this exhausting argument finally finished? 

IJoe, maybe i was a little too optimistic about the people rising up and killing the fascist, it just i am proud to have my freedoms. But you said something that was wrong on so many accounts; FDR wasn't our most democracy president, he was more like Stalin or Hitler. He thought that everyone should be made equal (good idea, but in practice) at any cost (very bad idea). He thought that all buissness should be government owned (communist idea, bad idea), and he thought that everyone should obey the government (really bad idea).  And btw, sooner or later, the Nazis Government would have fallen due to how much corruption it had, just like the USSR did.
  And I am not afraid to admit, yes, the Us did take German scientist after the fall of Germany. But out of that, we now have so many things, like anything having to do with space (including satellites and cell phones), so those scientist weren't all that bad, mainly cause if they tried to rise the Reich again, they knew Uncle Sam would be more than willing to give them a lead shower. But you do seem to have your facts straight, so keep on talking. And yeah, a fascist in the modern text is anyone who uses fear to intimidate people through the use of power, like the Nazis and the Soviets did.

Panzer4life wrote:
IJoe, maybe i was a little too optimistic about the people rising up and killing the fascist, it just i am proud to have my freedoms. But you said something that was wrong on so many accounts; FDR wasn't our most democracy president, he was more like Stalin or Hitler. He thought that everyone should be made equal (good idea, but in practice) at any cost (very bad idea). He thought that all buissness should be government owned (communist idea, bad idea), and he thought that everyone should obey the government (really bad idea).  And btw, sooner or later, the Nazis Government would have fallen due to how much corruption it had, just like the USSR did.
  And I am not afraid to admit, yes, the Us did take German scientist after the fall of Germany. But out of that, we now have so many things, like anything having to do with space (including satellites and cell phones), so those scientist weren't all that bad, mainly cause if they tried to rise the Reich again, they knew Uncle Sam would be more than willing to give them a lead shower. But you do seem to have your facts straight, so keep on talking. And yeah, a fascist in the modern text is anyone who uses fear to intimidate people through the use of power, like the Nazis and the Soviets did.

1. I didn't say a thing about german scientists, but members of fascist party in general, and slayers from Gestapo in particular.
2. Name me any US president you consider to be the most democratic, and I'm pretty sure, I'll find you "the proper" quote.
3. "...like the Nazis and the Soviets did." - though you are unimaginably wrong, still - and like US does right now...

You are more than welcome for the remarks ;) Dare I ask in what you have your degrees?
Also, I doubt the Russians did not hire any high ranking Nazi party members. As far as I know, both sides tried to capture as many 'usefull' people. To put it more precise, both sides tried really hard to prevent the other side from getting their hands on usefull nazi stuff.
If you want to talk about the best army of WW2 than I think I can say with near certainty that you can't name one of them as the best.
tThere simply are to many variables. For example: The war fought between Japan and the USA differed greatly from that fought between the USA and Germany. Secondly, the Japanese and German army pretty much kicked the asses of their opponents during the first years of the war. It changed when the USA, Britain, and the SU joined forces.
To make a long story short: there are too many variables to answer this question.

Cheers

Tico_1990 wrote:
You are more than welcome for the remarks ;) Dare I ask in what you have your degrees?
Also, I doubt the Russians did not hire any high ranking Nazi party members. As far as I know, both sides tried to capture as many 'usefull' people. To put it more precise, both sides tried really hard to prevent the other side from getting their hands on usefull nazi stuff.
If you want to talk about the best army of WW2 than I think I can say with near certainty that you can't name one of them as the best.
tThere simply are to many variables. For example: The war fought between Japan and the USA differed greatly from that fought between the USA and Germany. Secondly, the Japanese and German army pretty much kicked the asses of their opponents during the first years of the war. It changed when the USA, Britain, and the SU joined forces.
To make a long story short: there are too many variables to answer this question.

Cheers

+1000

@Tico_1990
Degrees:
in law, including deep study of common history from pre antique times to contemporary history (took a three years' course) + history was my first favourite subject at school (which makes english second).
international law and translations.
But this really doesn't matter, 'cause unlike western colleges and universities (again, no offence here) russian ones give a really wide horizon of common knowledge (it mostly applies to humanitarian ones). So, due to that educational tradition, which takes it's start long before the appearance of the Soviet Union, the one, who studied literature, for example, is also very well suited with linguistic and common history knowledge (if he wasn't just spending his time throughout his student years).
Russians NEVER hired any war criminals, be it any member of the SS, SD, Gestapo etc. All members of the fascist party, with quite a few exceptions, were considered felony criminals. Those were not all sentenced for the simple reason of their enormous numerousity. So it was mainly brought down to random arrests and imprisonments.
"To make a long story short: there are too many variables to answer this question." - then lets close this more than arguable topic for the sake of peace on Earth.  :)

Last edited December 27, 2010 at 8:28 PM by IJoe

I'm a history student my self and I live in the Netherlands, I think I dare say that I've got a rather broad education.
And I agree, let's close this discussion between us.
Cheers