Soviet's Upgrades

Well, the mod is awesome. But I think the upgrades for soviet infantry would have global effects since they're quite expensive. T34/85 upgrade affect later units, I don't complaint. But for the infantry, I would like the upgrades affect existing units. I rarely lose a quad. When I see combat ineffectiveness, I usually fall back because I don't want to watch my men just dieing. But these upgrades mean I need to sacrifice some quads to build new upgraded quads.

redguardsoldier wrote:
When I see combat ineffectiveness, I usually fall back because I don't want to watch my men just dieing.

Thats not how you play as Russians  :P

True. If you buy the ingenery upgrade and have lots of ingenery already on the field, what you have to do is charge at the enemy and get them all killed. And if as you do that, you keep a heavy mortar nearby, then... well...

Im like the OP , i know conscripts are cheap and crappie but after I upgrade them I still dont just run existing units into 2 gren squads

BATTERIES wrote:
Im like the OP , i know conscripts are cheap and crappie but after I upgrade them I still dont just run existing units into 2 gren squads

Have you noticed the kills/deaths ratios for normal games with this mod? You are expected to double your opponent in deaths, at least. I once won with PE 192-60.

You will not get far playing Soviets if you don´t learn to be ruthless to your own troops.

When Stalins men were getting slaughtered he didn't pull them back, he sent more in  :P I can see the problem if you have lots of units already out on the field but if the change was instant then the Russians would be extremely overpowered.

hmm good for those guys on the front stalin was only the ruler of the state. And not a general at a battle. I think the guys is right they should globalise the upgrades a bit. There freaking 200 ammo. That freakky goddamn much. Thats what in a normal game a rocket artillery strikes cost. And those come once in a while cuz there so expensive. And one of the dev said to me: the idea behind it is, u dont get all the upgrades in the same game. I agree with that, but you need a bit of diversial army otherwise youre going to losee. And if you got some guards already on the field and then you do the upgrade there ******* useless.. So that wasnt the hole idea behind in 1943, those guys also got new equipment when it arrived not only the replacements.

People will soon learn to use their munitions proactively; i.e. upgrading tank before it comes out.  I kind of feel like the infantry should be able to return to base and get the upgrades though.  After Ingenery are fixed of course :).  (unless the fix involves a price increase)

Think of it like the cool down eraser in a PE base with defensive operations. 

And from what I read in the guide, special abilities are free, only need to wait them cool down. But after purchase HEAT round for Zis-2, I still need 150 muni points to use it. What the hell?
And there're still many things that require muni points. Didn't the devs said that the soviets only need muni points to purchase upgrades?

I agree that the upgrades are to expensive by the time you have enough munitions to upgrade infantry its already time to start building tanks

I don't think the whole "charge your un-upgraded units into enemy lines" idea is very helpful in a game like CoH. First of all the idea itself is kind of sick - I don't know why so many people have a hard-on for it. Maybe I'm taking the game too seriously. Whatever.

But more importantly the suggestion to waste your crappy units and build upgraded ones just doesn't jive with the scale that we deal with in CoH. If we were playing a game with thousands of soldiers, I'd understand. But sending in a few squads to die because they're crappy could seal a game in your defeat if you do it at the wrong time. It would be stupid if you had to sacrifice a few squads to relieve some precious population points but right after you do so your enemy capitalizes on this and attacks you. Kind of a "between a rock and a hard place" situation.

The infantry upgrades definitely should be proactive.  Its annoying having a bunch of conscripts and ingenery left over after you upgrade them.  They are essentially worthless.  I understand in the case of the T34 and SU, but for infantry, upgrades should be proactive so you dont have to waste precious resources.

Just because they arent upgraded doesnt mean they are worthless. If you have 2 squads of ingenery and one is upgraded, and you kill one off because it is "useless", they you now have 4 rifles pointed at the enemy. If you keep both, yes one is weaker, but that is still 4 more rifles pointed at the enemy, which is never a bad thing.

redguardsoldier wrote:
And from what I read in the guide, special abilities are free, only need to wait them cool down. But after purchase HEAT round for Zis-2, I still need 150 muni points to use it. What the hell?
And there're still many things that require muni points. Didn't the devs said that the soviets only need muni points to purchase upgrades?

I have no idea what they were thinkign when they made the HEAT round cost 150 muni to use. It is a total waste considering it barely lasts more than 3 shots and the boost isint even great. The 17 pounder's APDS shells only cost like 75 anyways.

That was a bug and is now fixed.

I myself find it also irritating that I have to waste infantry just to build and upgraded squad.

Maybe it is an idea that you like have an sort of tech upgrade. Like for example: "new arms for your comrades". it will cost some fuel and ammo(or it will cost some mp,fuel and ammo), and you could do that reseach at the armory.
And that you could then equip your infantry squads individualy with like : extra rifles, smgs and so on for a cost of ammo ofcourse.

Or like some one stated before that you could bring them back to your base and requip them there.

or, mabye you could make it so that after buying an upgrade at the armory, new units come out with the upgrade but old units have to go back to friendly territory to initate a slow upgrade via the current CoH individual unit upgrade system. That individual upgrade would be free but take a long time.

The concept for such solution is good – based on historical battles – at least I think so…
In the very beginning of Soviets counter attack soldiers on a battlefield were dying not in hundreds, but in thousands and more…

I think that ability to equip already trained soldiers with additional weapons is good, but only if necessary research in armory would be done, and such equipment should costs some resources. This new ability / possibility (in my opinion off course) should be activated not in armory, but in Mustering Tent. But as I’ve mentioned above – only after necessary research in Armory has been done.

Last edited January 26, 2010 at 11:48 PM by szaman

I agree, 200 muni is waaay too much considering you start with 0. By the time you get to 200 you already have strelkys.

how about an individual upgrade (available from the start) , like the panzershrek or mp44 for grenadiers/assault troops ?

or a uppgrade in mustering ten, support barracks and tank hall that will (for a reasonable cost, higher in tank hall then in mustering tent) uppgrade all units on field that is not up to date so they get up to date.