My thoughts on improving OH.

1) Right now OH vs SU matches are mass landsers vs mass cons, run around the map. Its almost as playing PE vs US minus the AC's. My point its that we need to bring the HMG34 in the battle faster. Some of you might say, well go play Wehr if you don't like, but thats the magic of wehr vs US, the flanking, the mines. Deffender/Attacker!

HMG 34 needs to get in the field faster to effectively fight Cons and get flanking going. Switch around Sniper with HMG-34 team as they don't need it early on


2) Combat pios need normal repairs. Since Wehr pios come with normal repair by default i dont see why Combat Pios should be the exception. Imagine playing whermacht T3 with primitive repairs. And dont tell me about the Famo, in 1v1 you dont go T4 everyday.

If you were to get normal repairs and survival training it makes them great and more of an equivalent towards Sturmovie Ingenery


3)Mines Mines Mines. Everyone of you who watched a vcoh tournament knows how important are mines. Mines win games some used to say. And the S-mine should be called Joke Mine. Fix it or get rid of it and bring back the vanilla mine.

5)LMG34 sqauds. Buff the damage and add the option to upgrade Panzerfusiliers with the LMG34. Altough they look like Neo i almost never use them. Even with the dual mag mp40 they fall so easy to focus fire in close range.

Last edited November 3, 2013 at 3:59 PM by Tom

1). I agree with this. Against these large numbers of Cons the Sniper has no real combat value except for forcing off Spotters and or CS models. I actually really like this. It can be balanced and fall into historical context at the same time. Cons will just swarm and Penal Battalions are even worse haha. I would like to see how this would pan out. Sniper goes to tier 2 support pool and mg-34 to tier 1 support pool.

2.) I also agree with this. I mean every builder unit starts with standard repair. It puts early vehicles of OH in a tight spot. This way the survival combat training has a new dimension of utility this way too. I heard the Famo was gonna receive some tweaks but as of right now Sturmpio's are very potent with flamers more so than the ability that is more about utility than straight up damage output.

3.) I personally think that the S-mine is cool but it seems to underperform. It doesn't even suppress squads most of the time and does little damage to cons. This seems to be random as always though. Sometimes S-mines are just epic against ingenery or even Guards but then the next second they almost nothing against Cons...

4.) Finally, this could be pretty cool and make the PF's more versatile. Perhaps as a doctrinal upgrade. I don't think this is a must but it might be a nice thing. Rather stress the other points more.

The following is my personal opinion! Please keep this mind when u read the following:
Guys... u were BETA TESTERS! We launched the Beta last winter! No one was playing or helping with the Ostheer.
We Devs have done all the balance stuff and thats the reason why we are still working on the balance.
WHEN u have balance issuses, please send us replays, replays and replays... or talk with devs (mumble?) to start some mp pvp games.
This threads with the "personal opinions" are nice to read but they dont help us because u need to play tons of games against humans to adjust the balance.

Thank u very much.

Rommel in function of a "normal user" here ;)

Last edited November 3, 2013 at 4:59 PM by Lord Rommel

Lord wrote:
The following is my personal opinion! Please keep this mind when u read the following:
Guys... u were BETA TESTERS! We launched the Beta last winter! No one was playing or helping with the Ostheer.
We Devs have done all the balance stuff and thats the reason why we are still working on the balance.
WHEN u have balance issuses, please send us replays, replays and replays... or talk with devs (mumble?) to start some mp pvp games.
This threads with the "personal opinions" are nice to read but they dont help us because u need to play tons of games against humans to adjust the balance.

Thank u very much.

Rommel in function of a "normal user" here ;)

all i have to say is that i 100% agree with rommel here
its nice to read that there are still ppl who want to improve the balance
but like rommel said
a) where was all this feedback in the cloased beta?
b) where are the replays?
c) still we need replays!!!

Tom wrote:
2) Combat pios need normal repairs. Since Wehr pios come with normal repair by default i dont see why Combat Pios should be the exception. Imagine playing whermacht T3 with primitive repairs. And dont tell me about the Famo, in 1v1 you dont go T4 everyday.

If you were to get normal repairs and survival training it makes them great and more of an equivalent towards Sturmovie Ingenery

They already have normal repairs by default. Mechanic vet improves the vet to combat repairs (less rec. damage while repairing)

Quote
3)Mines Mines Mines. Everyone of you who watched a vcoh tournament knows how important are mines. Mines win games some used to say. And the S-mine should be called Joke Mine. Fix it or get rid of it and bring back the vanilla mine.

I also noticed the s-mine damage is a bit inconsistent in vEF. Gotta see what we can do about it.

Quote5)LMG34 sqauds. Buff the damage and add the option to upgrade Panzerfusiliers with the LMG34. Altough they look like Neo i almost never use them. Even with the dual mag mp40 they fall so easy to focus fire in close range.

I'm quite reluctant to do so, LMG 34 squads are superior to hmg34 squads in buildings because they can dodge grenades easier. I'll look into this matter again, though.

Also, post replays pls. I can determine a lot easier where the problems lie if I can actually watch it.

@Darc
Yes we shall as much as possible from now on! Although in my game(I have the latest version) it says that the Pio's have rudimentary repair. I have proof here:

Either this is a typo or a bug :).

EDIT: These ones should be working:

http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/920152288668843726/C9A9DA8B91936AD76EC9A589212D940BD5181B2B/

http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/920152288671225728/3C8D99C03DD10FF1E9DAEF570A9392DCA5394AAB/

Last edited November 4, 2013 at 6:34 PM by chaosval3

Then the tooltip is not accurate. I reworked the repair stats after release, because the repair abilities were bugged. Now it's like this:

normal inf:
vet 1 - rudimentary rep
vet 2 - normal rep
vet 3 - combat rep
vet 4 - advanced rep

Pios start with normal rep but get combat repairs with vet, that also will improve with each vet level.
Your screenshots/links do not work btw. Only leads me to 404 page.

Last edited November 4, 2013 at 3:40 PM by dArCReAvEr

dArCReAvEr wrote:
I also noticed the s-mine damage is a bit inconsistent in vEF. Gotta see what we can do about it.

"Inconsistent" is truely the correct word. The problem with that is, you can't rely on it. But most of the time S-mine is underperforming somehow.

donthateme wrote:

dArCReAvEr wrote:
I also noticed the s-mine damage is a bit inconsistent in vEF. Gotta see what we can do about it.

"Inconsistent" is truely the correct word. The problem with that is, you can't rely on it. But most of the time S-mine is underperforming somehow.

S-mines have a higher chance to create casualties than the normal mines (35% -> 20%) However, there seems to be a bug which prevents the mine from doing said damage to larger squads like conscripts (as it works fine when used against ingenery/guards/CS). I'm currently checking their AoE stats, maybe some values do not fit it.

@Darc

Thanks for doing so! Did you check the links that I updated on the previous comment I made? It should show the rudimentary repair that sturmpio's have.

Yes, I've seen it. Looks like they use the PE repar description.. Will need to recreate new descriptions for these.

We can just use the description for the regular repair. We would need to create a new description for the vetted up ability though.

I think the S-mine should stay, maybe reduce the price to 20 muni.